BB&W Fresh Meat: “The Myth of the Good Guy”

May 7, 2013 | ** Guest Author ** |

The Myth of the Good Guy

By: Anissa Ashley

*Spoiler Alert: He does not exist.

Ask most women what best describes their ideal mate and the first adjective is usually “good” as in a “good” man. But, what does “good” mean?

In full disclosure, I am newly 25. I do not claim to know it all but from the experiences I have had, the people I have met and coupled with my love of psychology, I sincerely hope that what I have learned can help someone now or in the future. Everything is the truth except for the names.

Last year, a good friend of mine, Daisy, introduced me to her friend, Steve. Steve was working freelance in the Entertainment industry and Daisy believed I should meet him because we would hit it off, either professionally or personally, and needless to say, she believed Steve to be a really “good guy”. A year ago, Steve helped Daisy move into her apartment and during those two days, he was never inappropriate and remained a gentleman. They were friends for several years and it was always platonic.

One night in August, Daisy made a strong case for introducing me to Steve and ultimately inviting him to a party she was hosting. So, I met Steve…and sparks did not fly; at least not on my end. However, he emailed me the next day under the pretense of working together. We kept in touch and ultimately set drinks.

A month later, we reunited and had a great time, until the second drink. Up until the fateful second drink, there had been much laughter and friendly bonding which somehow encourage Steve to feel comfortable enough to ask me back to his apartment. I politely gave him a chance to retract his invitation since we were discussing working together but Steve looked me in my eyes and boldly owned it.

I declined and decided the evening, there laughter had died and things were awkward. Steve offered to walk me home, which I also declined. In an effort to change my mind, Steve tried to assure me that I would be able to “fend him off” if he tried to make a move during the walk. I bolted. Needless to say, Steve, aka the “good guy” was a huge sleaze.

The next morning Steve texted an apology and applauded my ability to maintain my professionalism despite his antics. When I asked him why he behaved so poorly compared to the way he treated Daisy, Steve responded: I don’t find her attractive. Steve also blamed me for making him “act sleazy” (a direct quote) and told me he wanted to make me his sex slave (another article for another post). I warned Daisy about Steve’s other side but since she has never seen it, it is difficult for her to understand. Daisy and I talk about a lot of things but never, ever Steve. Also, Steve and I are no longer in touch.

A year before that, I fell in love with Derek. It was passionate, intense, romantic and beautiful. For all intents and purposes, Derek treated me like a queen. He was a “good” guy. We got along great; we were best friends as well as partners. Then, I met his exes. Every single woman before me only had horror stories: “Derek cheated”, “Derek had a temper” “Derek this and that” and “Derek is a sociopath”. Yet my experience with Derek was terrific.

If Derek is in fact a sociopath, he definitely took a break during our time together because we connected in an honest, truthful and loving way. After we split, I heard he went back to his old ways; but that was none of my concern because our part of the story was over.

The lesson is all of this is: people have different experiences with different people because we affect people differently. Additionally, people also have different opinions of what “good” really means. “Good” is not a blanket term or adjective with a universal meaning. Our definition of “good” changes and grows in accordance with our life experiences and perceptions of love and relationships.

For those of you looking for love, the next time someone introduces you to a “good” man, take it at face value and be prepared to come to your own conclusion…because you just might find yourself being introduced to another Steve.

zipporah
I believe there are good men, but you have to watch out: some are just passive/aggressive. Good men are guys who are comfortable in their own skin, and who they are, that arent with a ‘wimp’ persona. That is really hard to find today since many men werent raised with their dads most of their 18+ years.
foreverhopeful
I have never, knock on wood had a date like that but in all honestly. all the men I dated or were casually acquainted were “good” men until they weren’t in my eyes. And, that happened when there was a bad split. Everyone’s experience is different but I agree with you just because someone says he’s a nice guy, good guy etc. and thinks you two would be perfect or should at least get to know each other doesn’t mean he is. People are sometimes different with their friends than they are with someone they are dating.
WendyLBarber
I don’t mean to make light of what happened to you but I was laughing. I’m so proud of your resolve and your ability to see a nut when you did. I think there are two types of good. One as mentioned, is that you want to think that people are inherently good, decent, honest folks. But when people start throwing around that you need a good man and I have one to introduce to you, red flags should go up because your idea of a good guy is different from mine. And Lori’s, and Terry’s.

In my youth, I was friends with a WW who knew a lot of people. Because I was single and looking, and I think she was trying to be nice but it would have been great if she asked me what my preferences were. She said she had a good guy she wanted me to meet. I asked her what he looked like and she said good looking. Second red flag. I told her to have a party and invite us both. OMG! He was a very dark BM, quite short, and a military chaplain. Not that there’s anything wrong with that but not for me. The wiccan, pagan, sci-fi, fantasy, let me dress up in black leather and wield a riding crop to your butt type of gal at the time. Needless to say, I left the party early and by myself.
- foreverhopeful
  @WendyLBarber I like your story!
- VictoriaAntoine
  @WendyLBarber That would be a red flag if they dont ask me what is my perefences
  - WendyLBarber
    @VictoriaAntoine I hear you. I was in my twenties back then and I’ve started to listen more to me. Dusting off the intuition.
dasdbobb
I do exist!!
- KingsDaughter
  @dasdbobb LOL Fantastic!
Ms. Kay
‘people have different experiences with different people because we affect people differently’….<—–This!
kia
Steve was passive aggressive. The first red flag with guys like him is when he invites you back to his place, or offers to walk you home when you two have just met. If he tried to make a pass at you when your alone at his place, or when he’s walking you home alone. There wouldn’t be anyone to prevent or stop his unwanted advances, which is dangerous for women. The second red flag is when he texts you an apology the next day instead of speaking to you in person. When people are getting to know each other.

You need to have face to face interaction. Texting is for high school. The third red flag is when he dissed your friend to you to throw you off guard and get you to like him – ‘Your friend’s a loser, but your not’ bs line. And finally when nothing he said worked, he blamed you, and tried to make you feel guilty for rejecting him. So he probably preys on women who have low self esteem and who crave attention from men. Which is why women must have standards and boundaries, and thoroughly vet the men they date. Another red flag is when you told your friend about his inappropriate behavior and she refused to believe you, and ignored it! And never wants to talk about him? Even though he dissed her to you! I don’t need friends like that, who live in their own delusional world, and refuse to face reality!

Derek are the kinds of guys I hate. They’re harder to spot. Because they are sociopaths in relationships. They show no signs to women that are typical of the other types of men that women are instructed to avoid such as: the player who wants to sex you right away, or the broke guy who wants your money. They say all the right things to women, and usually don’t reveal their true behavior until they have you under their spell, when its harder for women to break away from them emotionally. The ex girlfriends’ horror stories probably didn’t come out until after they were under his spell, but they wised up, and still managed to break off the relationship. I think people have different experiences in relationships depending on if women have boundaries and standards when dating. And if they thoroughly vet the men they’re dating properly. Which is why women should follow advice similar to ‘The Rules’.

How To Spot A Sociopath – 10 Red Flags
http://www.naturalnews.com/036112_sociopaths_cults_influence.html

Non Negotiables – 10 Dating Principles to Live By
http://themoxiesophic.com/2012/02/28/dating-principles-to-live-by/

The Rules
http://www.amazon.com/All-Rules-Time-tested-Secrets-Capturing/dp/0446618799/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1367972749&sr=1-1&keywords=the+rules
dani-BBW
This is my pet peeve when women tell me about some guy they just met – “he’s a really good guy.” Really?! How do you know that? What have you based that kind of character assessment on, after a couple of dates and phone calls? I try to point them to make observations about specific behaviors – “oh he’s quite polite, he’s kind to wait staff, etc.” I think making blanket judgments early on causes many women to develop blinders and not fully vet men early on, then five months later the guy turns out to be nuts.
- Toni_M
  @dani-BBW Honestly? I think a lot of times that’s the thirst talking. When you haven’t had water in several days, even horse piss tastes like fine wine.
Jamila
“…told me he wanted to make me his sex slave.”

I didn’t think Steve was sleazy until you said he told you the above. Asking a woman back to your place is not necessarily a sleazy move–if he finds you attractive and you find him attractive and the two of you both want to spend the night then cool, it’s no problem. I don’t think a man is sleazy JUST/ONLY because he asks a women to come home with him. All you have to do is say no. If he continues with the innuendo THEN that’s a sleazy move.

“The lesson is all of this is: people have different experiences with different people because we affect people differently. ”

This is so, so, so true, and it’s actually something that I’ve been thinking lately as I reflect on some past relationships. Depending on the situation and a multitude of other circumstances people will see you differently. To one person you are the best thing since sliced peanut butter and jelly sandwiches–you are smart, sweet, kind, loyal, and endearing. Another person may think you remind them too much of their ex and that makes them see you as a b*tch.
AshleyFisher
If a guy describes himself as a good guy then I walk away at a very high speed because if that is the first thing they say about themselves then you are in for a world of hurt.
RDaneelOlivaw
I know I’ve been a “good guy” or not, depending on who I’ve been with. My ex was so upset during the process of our breakup that she would say repeatedly “You know, I always told people what a good man you are, but you’re not.” I have to admit, because of all the heartache it caused her (and me), I often seriously questioned whether I was a good guy. My fiance and I have discussed this many times. Her answer is that I’m the best man she knows. Looking back at my past relationship, I’d say we had 10 or 11 great years followed by 4 or 5 terrible ones, and it was time? Did I change? yes. But, more importantly, “we” changed and just were not in the same place. So in my ex’s book now, I’m “bad”. As a man, all I can do is ask myself Am I treating every person in my life with integrity? Am I respectful of my friends, family, co-workers, and people I interact with? If I can look at myself in the mirror and say yes, then it’s up to others to answer whether I am “good” or not. I can tell you it’s painful to be thought of as bad dude. But right now, that doesn’t matter so much, because I pass the test with the person I care about the most.
Fleurdebene
Great post! Thanks!
GuestView
Individuals show people different sides of themselves for many reasons. One person may want someone, a boyfriend/girlfriend, to see them as shy and sweet and others, co-workers, as confident and assertive. Maybe by assessing that person or group they came to the conclusion that was the best way to get the love interest and the other is a way to be taken serious at work. From each of those people that create a reality they want that person to see. Many people are not as simple a we make them out to be. Especially men whom we think we have figured out. Life experiences can make them as complex as women. I’ve known a few guys I would call good guys. They were respectful, reliable, concerned for others, love family etc. Only to find out when women came into play they were hound dogs. Disappointing but I wasn’t willing to dismiss me because of their flaws. I wouldn’t date them or allow my friends to for sure. One had many issues that made him do things to escape his reality for awhile but after partying and whoring he was back to his good behavior. I don’t think he is a bad guy. There just more to him than you can see unless you get to know him. Besides people are afraid of judgement so they mostly show you their best side at first. Sometimes the case can be made on an individual basis as good or bad but overall its not black and white.
The ArchAngel
There are good men in this world. Just don’t expect good men to be perfect. Yes, good men are going to look at beautiful black women and have lustful desires. They’re good not perfect. Good men are truthful with black women about their intentions. History tells of one man who was perfect and his name was Jesus.
LadyHumor
There is a different between good men and ‘good’ men. One is objective and the other is subjective.

Objectively, good men are those that value their integrity, consistently improve their character, have a deep desire to do noble things, and truly respect all manners of people as they would respect themselves. Sure, such men aren’t always perfect, but instead of using that as an excuse, they tend to acknowledge their mistakes and then endeavor NOT to do it again. These are the types of men that you either like or you dislike because of their general virtuous living (and that says more about you then anything else.)

Subjectively, ‘good’ men are the men that are ‘good to you’ until they aren’t anymore. To highlight this point better, I’ll give an example: You are at a nice restaurant with the ‘good’ man in question. While he gives you compliment after compliment about various things, he, at the same time, will turn around and insults the ‘lowly’ waiter who is serving your meal. Such a man may seem ‘good to you’ because he treats you well, but could an outsider/casual observer say the same thing?

While I do agree that we as humans tend to show different sides of ourselves to different people (i.e. you don’t treat your mother, pastor, and doctor the exact same way but you still give them high respect), the different in behavior will be a subject of mild degrees. However, when your man is showing a Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde personality when dealing with other types/levels of people, that should be a red flag to you.
FriendsofJay
I think men and women both expect to find “perfection” when “good” is usually the best there is. We’re human, not saints.
First off, there’s the person who had a bad romantic experience (usually a woman) and now he or she looks deeply into everything the new person says or does for any hint of an psychotic/neurotic nature. If you’re looking for imperfections in a someone, YOU ARE GOING TO FIND THEM.
Secondly, men like sex. Really girls, we can’t help it. Nature made us that way. What we can help is how we act on those desires. And remember this, no matter how much a guy loves you, if he sees a woman with a great figure, HE IS GOING TO LOOK. But that’s usually ALL he’s going to do. It doesn’t mean he’s going to leave you, it doesn’t mean you’re not enough for him, it just means he’s a guy and he’s going to look. Many times women wonder why their boyfriends or husband look at porn occasionally. He’s not sick (unless he spend hours a day looking at it), he’s not a potential pervert, rapist or sexual harasser, he just likes to look. You girls don’t like to look at Brad Pitt or Tom Cruise??
You may be looking or anticipating false red flags like some of those above. Some real red flags are when he lies to you constantly; he tells you he’s someone that he isn’t. He claims he’s a doctor, lawyer or accountant, but he never seems to act the part or dress the part and he constantly seems short of money or drives a beat up car. He won’t give you his telephone number, or won’t tell you where he lives, or won’t take you to see his family. He says he’ll pick you up at six, but never shows up and has an excuse that a child wouldn’t believe. In short whenever 2+2 don’t equal four, you have a right to be suspicious.
Yes, some guys are players. Some just want a roll in the hay and then do a disappearing act. On the other hand, as I’ve said often, many women THINK they can read minds when they can’t. And they misinterpret a word or an action. It kind of like the old joke that an actor should say the line as it’s written in the script. If the line is “he was head over heels in love with her” he shouldn’t interpret the line as “the sight of her doubled him up.” Which is a different interpretation of that line.
There’s a really cute commercial on TV where the over voice narrator say, “no matter how perfect we humans try to be, we keep running into obstacles–other humans.” There’s a good deal of psychology and philosophy in that little commercial. And its true!
- edenifill
  @FriendsofJay Agreed. I don’t see any red flags here. I think it was very telling when he said that he didn’t act that way with Daisy because he said, “I don’t find her attractive”. There you have it ladies: a man can’t see himself with you if he can’t imagine sleeping with you. He’s a man, they’re like that. Period. It doesn’t mean that he’s a player or a sleaze if he offered the opportunity for sex; rather, he tried to sleep with a woman he was attracted to and was rebuffed. I’m sure he gained some respect for the author (as he said to her the day after). It didn’t have to be awkward because it’s normal.
  How do you know he’s not a good guy? In this instance, I would say that if he kept pushing for you to go to his place, despite you saying ‘no’, then it’s a sign that he doesn’t respect your decision. If he drank too much, or flirted with the waitress, or didn’t even offer to walk you home, I would say ‘move on’, but I think this guy needs to be cut some slack.
  BTW, why is having lustful desires for an obviously attractive black woman a bad thing? As long as he conducts himself well, what is the big deal? Are we not supposed to have men lust after us? What are we, nuns?
Beruda
There are plenty of good men and women in the world just don’t expect them to be perfect :).
AreaRosales
Thanks for tellings your story to me and others viewers. Now you left me questioning what a good guy REALLY is?
CAPT SMOOTH
@AshleyFisher Wow! That’s pretty cynical. I consider myself a nice guy. Most guys won’t admit it anymore because it’s the kiss of death when it comes to relationships! Most women “SAY” they want a good guy to settle down with and then they date every lowlife within eyesight from coke dealers to convicts because good guys are just too dull and they need the “bad” boy!
If the good guy is dying out, it’s because too many women have been pushing him towards the casket!
CAPT SMOOTH
@RDaneelOlivaw Fact: an overwhelming majority of divorced women think their ex’es are bad guys. In some cases they are correct and others they don’t want to admit they had any part of the failure of the marriage! It takes two to tango and sometimes the divorce is because of a “bad” woman!
AshleyFisher
@CAPT SMOOTH You’ve literally said each and every single line that the woman hating beta male is known for. You now have my side-eye. Have a good day.
CAPT SMOOTH
@AshleyFisher
For your info, I am neither a beta male nor a woman hater! I love women but as with many of us “Good guys” I’m a little frustrated with some of the flakey ones I have encountered! If a topic is going to deny the existence of the good guy, there should be a little counterbalance!
You have a good day too!
MissFLondon
Great Post
MichaelD2013
@Beruda
Lol Exactly
MichaelD2013
The problem I have with some women are the ones who chased after the “Exciting Bad Boys” through their formative 20’s and end up being (Excuse the phrase please ladies) “Damaged Goods”. Some come to their senses in their 30’s. After which they seek out the “Good Guys” who are expected to be “Perfect” and willing to deal with their past relationship issues without complaint or take care of somebody else’s responsibilities from a previous (or multi-previous) relationship(s). That’s an assumption that needs to be talked about upfront before the relationship takes off. That and too many women jump from relationship to relationship without dealing with their previous emotional baggage. Instead they drag into the next relationship with perhaps the “Good Guy” they were looking for and mess it up totally. Always take some time off between relationships and deal with any emotional issues. Find yourself again 1st. Always ask yourself “What could have I done better” ..
MichaelD2013
@CAPT SMOOTH @AshleyFisher
Capt Smmoth is quite right. I’ve been “The Nice Guy” all my life until it was taken advantage of on so many occasions by “Women on the bad boy rebound” I just put that part of my personality away for safe keeping. I take it out when I meet some woman who actually deserves it otherwise it collects dust in the closet.