Once Upon a Time: The Origin of Preference

Once Upon a Time: The Origin of Preference

A look into the minds of our “Hotties,” and how they developed their preference

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Author : Christelyn Karazin

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When I feature a “hottie” every week, I’m in the enviable position to shrink their heads and find out why they have a preference for we melanin-rich of the female persuasion. Almost unilaterally, it’s the skin, the hair, the eyes, the silhouette, and smile of women with a West African phenotype that attracts them, so that’s a big “WOO HOO” for like, 90% of African American women. But lately I’ve gone a bit deeper to try to get to what originated this attraction, and most of what I’ve heard is that the preference was developed during childhood or early adulthood.

–One ridiculously handsome Chinese man who prefers black women said that he remembers he crushed on his good friend’s Jamaican mother, who ran a pizza delivery with her husband. She was always kind to him, giving him free pizza and just generally being a warm and friendly mom-type.

–Another high-profile man who runs a bank on the East Coast says that his preference for black women might be a combination of the phenotype preference and the similarities he recognizes in his Italian matriarchs and the characteristics of black women he finds attractive.

–And then there was the funky, off-the-beaten-path tattooed dude who’s first-grade crush was a browned-skinned girl who wore her hair in three twisted ponytails–two on each side and one at the nape of her neck.

–Finally, there was white-girl-only European guy who had a chance sexual encounter with a black woman and had the “Once you go black you never go back” reaction. His attraction has since evolved from just the physical, and was seriously dating a black woman and was engaged to be married (didn’t work out). He now tells me that he wants nothing more than to marry someone and have a brood of little brown babies.

You know what I noticed too? Only one of these guys developed a preference for black chicks out of some jungle-booty fetish. I suspect the origins of preference for non-black men might have started for many on the board in just the same way. But! A recent study suggests that women put more weight on intellect AND race more than males do. For men, it’s all about physical attraction:

An abstract from “Gender Differences in Mate Selection: Evidence From a Speed Dating Experiment,” published in Oxford Journal’s The Quarterly Journal of Economics.

We study dating behavior using data from a Speed Dating experiment where we generate random matching of subjects and create random variation in the number of potential partners. Our design allows us to directly observe individual decisions rather than just final matches. Women put greater weight on the intelligence and the race of partner, while men respond more to physical attractiveness. Moreover, men do not value women’s intelligence or ambition when it exceeds their own. Also, we find that women exhibit a preference for men who grew up in affluent neighborhoods. Finally, male selectivity is invariant to group size, while female selectivity is strongly increasing in group size.

Hmmm…could this partly explain the rabidness of the Nothing-But-A-Brother sect?

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VintageNarcissa 925 pts

I used to work with this Argentinean man, who is now married - I'm not sure what his wife is I believe she is some ethnicity of white - but he told me, before he met his wife he was extremely attracted to black women and was hoping to marry a black woman. However, most of the black women he encountered never took him seriously for various reasons - but the most prominent one was because of his race and ethnicity, they didn't believe a non-black man could be interested in them and felt he was just trying to use them for sex. When all along, he was extremely marriage centered and just wanted to find someone to settle down with. I feel it's extremely important for non-black men to speak out about their preferences and affinities toward black women. Because many black women blatantly do no know or do not believe that they have options out there other than black men. It's important because there's few platforms out there telling black women that they are beautiful and so many more telling us that we're this, that, overweight, bad hair, dark skin, white men don't want us or only want us for one thing. Influence is a powerful thing.

jess1 109 pts

VintageNarcissa Why dont these bw stop to think that a man cant use them for s ex if they dont sleep them?

VintageNarcissa 925 pts

I feel like everyone has the potential to be attractive to an infinite amount of races, however social constructs and nurturer influences come into play as children get older and aid in defining what people find attractive. As we can note, two of the men describe experiences from their childhood, showing that their preferences have always been unbiased. The third man, lets say for example, may have grown up in an area where there were no black people so may not have had the opportunity to develop an affinity toward black women until he was older. But just as I said, his social construct could have altered his view of the world until he was able to correct it himself. Even Mr. Jungle-booty shows a valid point, because people do not learn to hate until they are taught, and then they have the choice to build on what they've learned to their benefit or detriment. Maybe the discovery of his attraction to black women wasn't the most tasteful, I'll say for lack of a better word, but if what he wants in marriage, then hopefully he'll soon realize that he needs to look beyond looks and sex and start focusing on values and character to select a suitable wife.

Joyce345 910 pts

VintageNarcissa

I think a man is a man is a man is a man. He can be captured by a beautiful woman regardless of her race. Doesn't matter if she is Mongolian or Somali or White or Latina or Black. A beautiful woman is a beautiful woman. A charming woman is a charming woman.

jess1 109 pts

sorry this is off topic but does anyone know why this new commentin system wont let mw type caps?

ann4950 309 pts

YOURS CAPS ARE NOT NECESSARY. We get your point.

LadyLittlefoot 314 pts

Thanks to all your ladies and gents who have shared your experiences of dating and mating outside of your race. It is gratifying to know that I am not weird for appreciating a wide variety of God's creation. I am hearted by your journey and am becoming more and more open to accepting love in whatever form it comes. It's sad for me to know I started out being open to all kinds but through socialization I was influenced to think that no one else outside of another brown person would want to be with me for life. I started distancing myself from that belief about two years ago but this blog and the experiences shared has helped me to see my youthful openness was not misguided and just because I like all shades does not mean I hate my own.

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

SO.... how about that Leif Garrett? :>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hihp_Jjdnsg

oh & I forgot The Bay City Rollers LOLZ ^.^

http://youtu.be/CGD27WgtKhI

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

ForestElfQueen You keep it light and friendly, :-) enough with disinformation.

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

eugeniamitchell yep. that was enough of that. :D

RETRO CRUSH PARTY TIME!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXygi3efjL8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sC4U08o0eGE

LadyLittlefoot 314 pts

ForestElfQueen eugeniamitchell Thank you!! That person was making my head hurt with all the mis information and gaslighting.

Toni_M 4842 pts

LadyLittlefootForestElfQueeneugeniamitchell This is what needs to happen in posts when persons show up to BS and derail, just side-step them all together. :) The objective of these persons is to STOP DISCUSSION AND PROGRESS. We know this, but for people who are new to these type of discussions or who lurk, not everyone who posts here is a friend. That's why it's important not to give these people what they want. Let's keep things on topic and not play into their hands.

So anyway, I was too young for Leif; I came of age during the 90s boy band craze: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikI-4D_1s-c

Funny thing is, I elected to cover my ALL of my walls with pictures of cute white guys from various pop groups. And I remember being questioned about all the white guys on my walls and why I wasn't interested in "black boy bands" whenever I wanted to watch their music videos (One aunt got really huffy about it). But I was pretty much stating my preference for non-BM now that I think about it. I wasn't concerned with anyone's disapproval. I'm still not.

Toni_M 4842 pts

ForestElfQueeneugeniamitchell OMG, ANDY GIBB WAS SO CUTE!

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

i noe rite?!! ^.^ Toni_M eugeniamitchell

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

Toni_MLadyLittlefooteugeniamitchell

ok onto some of my later 'imprints' haha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIDphDFQjUs

http://youtu.be/0xxeFfDOTkI

LadyLittlefoot 314 pts

ForestElfQueenToni_Meugeniamitchell I've always like Kevin from Backstreet and I think he is a contributing factor to my fascination with the guys with green eyes and dark hair :-D

http://youtu.be/O6XE1XRiLeY

LadyLittlefoot 314 pts

ForestElfQueenToni_Meugeniamitchell Also wanted to say I was enjoying the discussion before it got derailed. My gov''t computer doesn't play nicely with newer anything so I can't comment from work but today I had steam coming out my ears a few time with the idiocy that kept showing up in my inbox ... I'm better now. :-)

Toni_M 4842 pts

LadyLittlefootForestElfQueen l love his cheekbones, his and Brian's

Betty Boo 245 pts

Toni_MLadyLittlefootForestElfQueeneugeniamitchell @ Toni yeah you are a little young LOL, yeah I Loved the jacksons, but i loved Sean Cassidy, Parker Stevenson (Hardy Boys), William Katt as I aforementioned, David Cassidy, Scott Baio, HUBBA HUBBA.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVWp1BomliY

VintageNarcissa 925 pts

Toni_M

It's funny, when I was growing up, my friends and I all adored the Backstreet Boys - and for one summer my high school best friend and I were in love with NYSNC. And out of all of my friends, I was the only one for the most part, who maintained an interest in non-black men. I have one friend who's family told her that it liking white boy bands was one thing, but if she ever dated a white man they would disown her. The irony of it all is he was the one who introduced the rest of us to the Backstreet Boys. And now she's a die-hard - nothing but a black man - advocate. Now I'm very afraid for her because I know she is a good person and deserves an amazing relationship, but she's even admitted it, that the type of man she wants does not exist. I personally feel that she is the prime candidate for IR dating, and could probably attract some amazing men of other races if she was open to it.

iamme73 16 pts

I find this discussion interesting. I have never given thought to the moment that I found any racial group of women attractive. I was just attracted to women. So it is odd to read other men's accounts of when they "discovered" an attraction to black women.

It is also interesting how people seem to be very cognizant of whom they are attracted to based on that person's race.

I just assumed that all people see other human beings that they find attractive/have an attraction towards regardless of hue, so I just find it interesting on many BWE websites how they seem, maybe this is my own bias, to push this idea that men who aren't black find black women attractive.

I just assume that black women based on their real life experiences would already be living in that world and wouldn't need it confirmed. Like do some black women need confirmation that black men have an attraction for black women or don't they already know this based on their life?

But I began to think maybe these blogs are making another point about non black men having an attraction, which represents some deeper level of desire, towards black women that is different from knowing that non black men find some black women attractive.

Ricky T 457 pts

This is what we all want to live by, but in reality, its not true. People's attractions are heavily based on what our modern 1st world society tells us. Which really puts a damper on the word 'modern'.

Let's pretend that people ARE attracted to just people. and love is sporadic, being developed and happened by its own natural ways. However, the IRR paring (in real life as well as in media) is only limited to a certain color/gender. If love was real and everyone met up through natural love, you'd have equal percentages for every ethnicity/gender. However, the fact that you see a lot of certain combos ( bm/wf, wm/af ) tells you that money, power, and culture have its hands in deciding what love should and shouldn't be. iamme73

Christelyn 3210 pts moderator

I co-sign. To think people just find each other and don't notice race and status is some Molly-Polly pie-in-the-sky nonsense. Ricky T iamme73

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

Christelyn Yes, b/c ppl have eyes ppl notice things and find different things attractive. Saying you're attracted to all women is an outright lie, no one is attracted to all women b/c those women may have things that may not find attractive. Now tell me you're attracted to someone who is 500 lbs as well as a woman that is 130 lbs and fit. Yea right, we all have things including and beyond race that we are attracted too. Lots of blk women are attracted to only bm, no one ever seems to think that's weird racial preference. But attracted to a man of a different race then it must seriously be questioned. I'm always surprised at bw who are attracted to losers that don't pay bills, can't keep a job, and just are generally sorry just b/c he happens to be black and got swagger. I'm always shocked at that, way more shocked at that than I am about a bw being attracted to non-bm that supports, loves and takes care of her. We all have a variety of things that attract us to others and someone is simple enough to think we just one thing well, that's their issue b/c no man in this blog post said he was attracted to a bw just b/c she was black, there were physical attractions as well as personality traits, that's the recipe for true attraction and good relationship. Also no woman on here has ever said she was attracted to non-bm just b/c he non-bm, he had to have something else. Methinks someone doth protest too much. Ricky T iamme73

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

Christelyn Ricky Tiamme73

maybe slightly OT:

I think that the gender diff. aspect should be included. When I read things like "Hmmmph, then Imma go get me a white man", I cringe because really, IMO, a woman can't go out and get a guy. Well maybe it is possible but IMO it would be ill-advised. lolz. Also the tone of vengeance isn't too cute.

Ideally, the Afro-something women who have been automatically ignoring or rejecting non-Af guys that are interested will change that filter, if that makes sense?

The other part of "imma go get a white man" that bugs me is that there are other non-Af guys to consider and as well as the possibility(even if it's slim) of finding happiness with someone in the same group.

...also i wonder if there's a danger of it devolving into a Nothin' but a White Guy syndrome...with all of the possible abuses, lack of vetting etc. that we see in the NBB camp.

again all of this is just MO & I do understand that others have strong preferences.

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

ForestElfQueen But the 'Imma go get me a white men' women are different type of woman. Just b/c I had a preference, I like white guys and had preference doesn't mean I got that preference b/c I hate bm. Of course, that's what fragile egos of some bm think. I don't hate bm, don't really feel nothing about them. I find them attractive too, they're just not my preference. I've dated a couple of hispanic guys, came up here and found that they weren't as many as in Texas and the ones here were new to the country and I was used to the Americanized ones. My thought with the 'imma go get me a white man' crowd is that they are doing this out of some weird thing they still have with bm, trying to make bm mad or jealous and there are bw and bm who this sort of thing with IR dating. I don't know about anyone else but I'm not that woman, I have always preference for wm that had nothing to do with bm at all. Christelyn Ricky T iamme73

The Working Home Keeper 1495 pts

eugeniamitchellForestElfQueen Same here - my preference for white men really has nothing to do with black men. It certainly wasn't from negative dating experiences with black men, because I never dated them! I always knew I was attracted to white men, so I always knew I would date and marry a white man. Nothing against black men - just not my cup of tea.

iamme73 16 pts

eugeniamitchellChristelyn Ricky T

I don't get why you would attribute a woman dating a loser to her dating him because he happens to be black.

I mean a lot of this stuff is subjective, but I have seen many, many, many black women turn down many, many, many, many black men. In fact, I don't think it is unreasonable to say that women reject most of the men that approach them.

You see where I am going with this? In order for what you seem to believe to be true, a woman would have to date every man who happens to be black that approaches her when she is single, because the moment she turns down any man who happens to be black, then it becomes illogical to say or think, "Well, she is only in this relationship with this loser because he happens to be black". The question would have to be asked well why didn't she date those other men who happened to be black that she turned down?

You see what I mean?

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

eugeniamitchellChristelyn Ricky Tiamme73

@eug you're right the "Imma gos" are in a totally different headspace but I'm reading more of this lately and it gives me the willies. I also feel like it fuels the anti-IR butthats.

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

iamme73 That's called an example, it's a very specific example but it's an example. I don't think all bm are losers but in the case of should you date a loser bm b/c you only prefer bm is that better or should you date a non-bm that is supportive as a preference well which preference is better. Geez you want to start trouble huh? No I don't see what you mean b/c you don't see what I mean. What you're talking about is not what I'm talking about, there was a whole post there and you cherry-picked the part that would give you something to be offended by. Give me a break dude. Christelyn Ricky T

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

The Working Home Keepereugeniamitchell @WHK i hear you(I had 'date zeros' with 1 and a half AA so it isn't that).

I guess I'm wondering how the "Imma go gettas" fit into/affect BWE & IR.

I also wonder what guys think about it. If a guy chose to approach me out of vengeance against euro women, i'd be :s

...Is this part of the 'envy' contingent that the blogger (Khadija? IIRC) mentioned?

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

ForestElfQueen You know what they're always going to have fuel, they are waiting to be offended so you could see the most innocuous thing and they'll find some way to get up their raggedy soap box to lecture you. This one just did, too a whole post and found two lines of it and just ran with it and it wasn't even about what he's talking about. But that don't matter, he need to be offended so you can lecture some folks. Christelyn Ricky T iamme73

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

eugeniamitchellChristelyn Ricky Tiamme73 "You know what they're always going to have fuel, they are waiting to be offended so you could see the most innocuous thing and they'll find some way to get up their raggedy soap box to lecture you."

i guess you're right.

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

ForestElfQueen I don't think the 'imma go get me a wm' affect BWE at all, there's nothing you can do about them. It's there life they live as they choose. Women who are BWE are about more than just dating IR, that's one aspect but not the whole thing.

Christelyn 3210 pts moderator

OKAY! Let's leave this quibbling and go into the book discussion! We're talking, "Is Marriage for White People!" Ricky T iamme73

iamme73 16 pts

Ricky T

You are talking about something different then what I was talking about. I was talking about human beings having an attraction to people of all hues.

You are talking how that attraction factors into someone's dating and marriage choices. Yes, in a racist world people can have strong racial biases almost always in favor of white people. So, clearly in a world where white people are believed to be "better" than other groups.... you get the kinds of patterns and discussions surrounding interracial dating that you see in the world, mostly a focus on dating white people. It ends up that many people who aren't white will obsess over getting/being with white folks and kind of ignore one another.

Many will even convince themselves that being attracted to a white person is some "brave" choice, that marrying a white person is some kind of progress or answer to their problems. They'll even talk so badly about the race that they belong to...... so yeah in the real world dominated by white supremacy attraction may not be enough to overcome white supremacist ideology about who it is best to date or marry.

All I wrote is that human beings finding other human beings of a different hue attractive is very, very common. So, it is interesting to read accounts from men who "discovered" their attraction for black women as if that was something unexpected. In my mind, that is very interesting/odd. It is also interesting that many BWE blogs seem to stress that men who aren't black find black women attractive, when I think that would be self evidently true in the real lives of black women.

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

iamme73 This is just one post out of many, get over it. This a blog about IR dating and mating. You know some bw are totally unaware that non-bm find them attractive at all. This post is talking to them, us women who are in marriages and relationships with non-bm already know, you act as if we're stupid. We're not, this blog post is for the the thousands of lurkers out there who may not know. Ricky T

The Working Home Keeper 1495 pts

iamme73 But if a black woman is coming from a mostly black or all-black environment, how would she know non-bm would find her attractive? If such a woman is interested in dating interracially and just starting to move in more diverse circles, then yes she would need reassurance about non-bm finding her attractive.

Christelyn 3210 pts moderator

That's exactly it. If you look on "who's listening" you'll see that many more people read than comment, and I know for certain that girls/women at various levels visit this blog and a resource and support. I really don't like the elitism I often see from women who have "arrived" and then look down upon people who are starting their journey. There's no place for that here. eugeniamitchell iamme73 Ricky T

eugeniamitchell 3484 pts

Christelyn The thing I know about your blog is it's a good primer for women who just coming IR, at first I didn't get it but now that I've been here awhile, I know that you cater to many newcomers to IR and that's great b/c yes some folks are so deeply stuck in that drama of the bc, they need a place to help them dig their way out. Although I have 'arrived' so to speak LOL It's nice to help some of the women who are new to this whole journey. iamme73 Ricky T

Christelyn 3210 pts moderator

Why is it "odd?" Have you ever heard of socialization, and the power it has on people's decision making? And the negative socialization goes both ways. Blacks are socialized to be distrustful blacks, white and other races are taught the same thing about black people. Let's stop acting so brand new. I like dealing with reality. iamme73 Ricky T

iamme73 16 pts

eugeniamitchellRicky T

What am I to get over?

Ok, you say that some bw are totally unaware that non-bm find them attractive, my question would be how can that be if they are being approached by non bm who find them attractive?

I don't see how I acted if anyone was stupid, sorry if I came across that way.

My only question is if those thousands of lurkers who are bw in their real lives are being approached by non-bm who find them attractive why wouldn't they know that non-bm find them attractive?

The Working Home Keeper 1495 pts

iamme73 You're assuming they are being approached. Maybe they are not?

ForestElfQueen 2112 pts

iamme73 "All I wrote is that human beings finding other human beings of a different hue attractive is very, very common. So, it is interesting to read accounts from men who "discovered" their attraction for black women as if that was something unexpected. In my mind, that is very interesting/odd. It is also interesting that many BWE blogs seem to stress that men who aren't black find black women attractive, when I think that would be self evidently true in the real lives of black women."

I agree that it is super common for people to find each other attractive regardless of coloring, labels etc. OTOH In the US at least, there is this myth that Afro-Am. women are not desirable(for public dating & marriage), & especially not desirable to non AA men.

I'm guessing that this idea causes a shutdown or mental fence for some AA women (never my issue but i can understand it). Ppl sharing their own real life experiences on blogs etc helps to dispel the lie.

It is self evidently true in my life but I can't assume that every woman has same POV. There are also younger readers that can avoid ever absorbing the 'nobody wants you' toxin & G-d forbid, acting on it (desperation for AA men, blocking out decent men from other groups, self-imposed isolation, depression etc.)

...If idiots like this...

"Black women: White men are ASHAMED OF YOU!!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoUCYdHrQiw

...are free to share their warped ASSessments & predictions, then it's right and necessary for women in IRs(and the men who love them) to tell their truths.

Christelyn 3210 pts moderator

And do you see why/how this format works? The ladies and gentlemen who have "arrived" are in a position to SHARE their experiences. It's good done all around and everyone leaves happy, unless they are members of the GAT-DL. eugeniamitchell iamme73 Ricky T

iamme73 16 pts

The Working Home Keeper

Why wouldn't she know?

Maybe you mean something different, but to me it is obvious that non-bm find bw attractive.

And wouldn't her reassurance come from non-bm who find her attractive approaching her?

By using the word reassurance maybe we are talking about different things. Cause to me, knowing the nature of men, it is very, very obvious that men would be attracted to black women.

Are you talking about a black women needing reassurance of interest that is deeper than just attraction on the part of non-bm?

iamme73 16 pts

Christelyn Ricky T

Again, you are talking about white supremacy. I am talking about something much more primal. It is very, very obvious to me that non-bm would find bw attractive.

But unless a non-bm is a virulent racist, there is no reason why he wouldn't be attracted to black women? Why would any man need to "discover" some attraction that is 100% natural? It is just an odd/interesting thing to read about. I guess you can take the word odd to mean a negative, but I use the word to signify odd as in different from my own experiences.

iamme73 16 pts

The Working Home Keeper

Well, my question would be this, imagine a black women said that black men weren't approaching her, what would you tell her about black men?

Shouldn't the same apply to non-bm?

The Working Home Keeper 1495 pts

iamme73 I think I see what you're saying - by their nature, men like attractive women regardless of color. I agree. My husband wasn't looking specifically for a black woman. I just met his criteria of having a small frame and pretty face. My skin color didn't matter at that point! But yes, some black women do need to know that non-bm are interested in them beyond just physical attraction. Some black woman are apprehensive about dating non-bm men because they are worried the guy may only have sexual motives in approaching them.

The beauty of sharing our experiences here is that those of us who have dated and married interracially can provide real life evidence that some non-bm are genuinely attracted to black woman and want to have serious, committed relationships with them.