News Bits: Ann Coulter Says Civil Rights Just for Blacks?

 DeepWater Ann Coulter is an attention whore.  What do you expect?

 purplemoonflower123 

I had to google for the quote.

"These are not people who have black friends, who know black people. Oh, sorry, except, you know, Lawrence O'Donnell and Bill Maher, who date black gals. So they think they're freedom riders."

I don't know.  I think it's kind of funny.  Is that bad?

 Brice Cameron

 Well, she has dated a Black man, so does she consider herself to be one?  Seriously, I really don't understand what goes on in her mind, I don't want to try either.  I don't think she was saying it to be "funny"...ha-ha.  And the "black gals" comment really pinched a nerve with me, but that is just me. 

 purplemoonflower123  Brice Cameron It's the liberal version of "I can't be racist, some of my best friends/ex-girlfriend are black."

I have noticed that --some-- liberals tend to view their black acquaintances kinda like pets. Maher seems to be one of these, not sure about O'Donnell so I'll assume he's just your average lefty race-baiter.

 purplemoonflower123 

I do think she was trying to be funny.  I read her first couple of books.  There is truth in some of what she says.  But she just takes stuff to the extreme for entertainment value.  That is her schtick.  I think she was implying that those two get some feeling of nobleness from dating black girls.  Don't know if that is true or not, but that was what she was trying to say.  If she did date a black guy I'm sure that she would say that she dated him because of his character.  She sees people as individuals, unlike those nasty liberals who only look at people based on race.

 Brice Cameron

 Wow, so I'm pretty liberal, but had no idea that I was "nasty" and "only look at people based on race."  I guess I am with my hubby only for his Whiteness.   Thanks for the education!

 I am reminded of this song by Porno for Pyros:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtjRgEQFFio

Lyrics:

ever since the riots all i really wanted was a black girlfriend

they don't play around they're hard enough to keep any man in line thinking of my pale white skin thinking of her dark and smooth she against me my black girlfriend saw her on the corner where she lived, i asked her "can you braid my hair?" she and her girlfriends laughed at me, said that "it was easy but it'll cost you some"  looking out her window it's so exciting and foreign but i'm staying with my black girlfriend drivin' thru the hood in my chevy nova '62 my arm around my little black girl people on the corner looking in my car wanna do me but i won't give her back my little black girl "do you wanna come on in? do you wanna eat some? meet my family?" my black girlfriend

 Brice Cameron  Never heard of them, hmmm, interesting song.

 DeepWater 

A band called Jane's Addiction was popular when I was in high school.  Their most popular song was "Been Caught Stealing".  When they broke up, the lead singer and drummer formed Porno for Pyros. 

 Brice Cameron  Ok.  I remember Jane's Addiction and didn't know what became of them, now I know, thanks.

 purplemoonflower123 All I can say is it's too bad that Bill doesn't have a show this week.  He skewers her nicely in his monologues.  Laurence O'Donnell is dating the pretty Black anchor at MSNBC (Tamron Hall or something?) and Bill Maher has dated several Black women including Superhead, whose name escapes me.  Bill was doing it before it was a fashion statement lol, like Robert Deniro and Carlos Santana, so whatever that fascist tranny is on about doesn't matter.  Don't know about Laurence but I watch his show and he displays a depth of understanding about African Americans that tells me he must actually know Black folks and their diverse perspectives.

I don't think politics matter much in this attraction equation but I will say that I agree with Christelyn that a conservative/libertarian type who dates a Black woman seems to be less concerned about what people think about his choices generally, and specifically in this case tends to be more comfortable with any consequences of dating out.  My guy and I argue like cats and dogs about politics sometimes but I know for sure he isn't getting any "street cred" by being with me, so he must have decided on the merits.

 Statuesque

 I don't watch Bill's show, so I have no idea.  I knew that Laurence O'Donnell was rumored to be dating Tamron Hall, the news anchor.  I know my husband hasn't gotten any "street cred" being married to me and actually, it is has opened his eyes to racism, which was something he never had to think about growing up in a pretty conservative and very White (although changing) area of Seattle.  I think only one or two Black people went to his high school, that he can remember. 

Anyway, I've dated guys from all aspects of the political spectrum, and to put up with some of the negativity (from those inside and outside your family and social circle), you have to not give a f' what people think.  Some can hang, and some can't.  The last Libertarian I dated, decided that he couldn't deal and the relationship ended, which was a good thing because I met my husband afterwards.  The Liberal vegan guy, great guy but he was more concerned with trying to save the world than be in a realtionship. His parents/family were awesome, but he wasn't ready to be "tied down" and I was looking for marriage. 

So, no politics don't particularly matter, on the attraction equation.  There is much more to forming a relationship than a person's political leanings.  However, to say that a liberal "only look[s] at people based on race" is an incorrect statement.  

 ImaniScully

lol. what the heck is a Voldermort? Is it a rotent? lol. Or is it a name for a thoroughbred?

 AminahMatthews Google it:)

 Lili2009

 I yea believe it. She just want more and more publicity. Y'all know she used to dated Jimmy '' JJ' Walker?

 AminahMatthews  Lili2009  Noooooooooooooo way "dude", really?  For real?   Ann Coulter dated Jimmy "JJ" Walker?   From Good Times?    Word?   I am shocked, no way.   I can't even see the visual (in my brain) on that one.  When was this?

 DeepWater  AminahMatthews  Lili2009 "Ann Coulter dated Jimmy "JJ" Walker"

I am disappointed in Jimmy....

 EarthJeff  

You know what they say Jeff. Even muddy water puts out a fire.

 EarthJeff  AminahMatthews  Lili2009   So am I.    Well, she is, I think pretty, but I suspect those looks are covering for the tarantula that's creeping around under her skin.  (What an insult to tarantula fans, bwaaahhaaaa).

 Jamila I agree up to a point about the welfare state, but other than other European immigrants a lot of the immigration to places like Sweden are in fact poor immigrants....they offer asylum to quite a few refugees. Just because a (poor) immigrant may need assistance when they first get to a country doesn't mean that they always will.

But honestly even if you have closed borders and refuse to let in poor immigrants you're still going to have issues if the welfare system isn't balanced and only discourages people from working, as shown by some of the issues with benefits system in the UK. It's a great helping hand for some, but there are some who take advantage.

Plus I'm not so sure it has to be an either/or situation. One can have a flexible immigration policy without completely opening all the borders and still have a decent welfare system in place that ensures that folks don't fall through the cracks. At least I hope that's possible...not so sure anyone has quite figured out the right balance on that one. I might be in the minority opinion on this one though....

 ABCiE" I agree up to a point about the welfare state, but other than other European immigrants a lot of the immigration to places like Sweden are in fact poor immigrants...."

True, and Sweden is beginning to experience the problems that come along with allowing such a large number of refugees and other immigrants in. I'm not opposed to all immigration, but it must be managed and controlled enough to benefit the host country. 

From a New York Times article:

"

Sweden’s liberal policies have become costly. In the 1950s, ’60s and ’70s, Sweden, which had more manufacturing jobs than citizens to fill them, invited immigrants in. Most came from other European countries. They worked and paid taxes. Those were good years for Malmo, which had shipyards and a textile industry.

When those jobs disappeared, Sweden stopped the flow of immigrant labor, but not the flow of refugees, many of whom clustered in Malmo and other former industrial centers. Jobs were still scarce, but housing was available, apartments built long ago for laborers.

In some of those apartment blocks, the unemployment rate among immigrants stands at 80 percent. Still, their children need schooling, and they have elderly parents who need health care. Some are damaged by the violence they have lived through. They suffer from post-traumatic stress disorder and drug and alcohol addictions.

Prof. Jan Ekberg, an economist at Linnaeus University, questions the policies that allowed so many refugees to settle far from jobs. “They are depending on the public sector now as never before,” he said. “That was a policy mistake.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/27/world/europe/27sweden.html?pagewanted=all&_moc.semityn.www

 Jamila Ah! I remember that article. Yeah Malmo is having some serious issues right now. In part because of the immigration policy before, but could part of it also have to do with the Integration policy? They put a ton of refugees in grouped into one area without access to jobs or a way of moving up the social ladder.

Also the high unemployment rate among immigrants isn't just a matter "letting-in-too-many-foreigners-without-having-enough-jobs." The very idea of what it is to be a Swede has been questioned in recent years, in part because of a feeling of isolation or feelings of never having the ability to be consider truly Swedish by some non-ethnic (non-white) Swedes. It's not unusual for some that don't have typical Swedish names to change them because of problems with discrimination in the job market. Same in France.

And my bleeding heart tendencies also has issues with the idea of turning away refugees out of a fear of having "too many" poor immigrants. I grew up with folks whose parents came to the US as "poor immigrants" but in part because of the integration programmes in place (which very well may differ from city to city or state to state) worked there way up and created their own businesses and by extension jobs in their local communities.

But then again I'm also speaking from the position of (at least for now) being an American immigrant in Europe. So my viewpoint is problem skewed because of that and because of all the rhetoric as of late over here about immigration in general. Immigration policy is much more complex than folks give it credit for....it's much more than just a numbers game of "OK we're only letting in X number of people."

Two interesting articles on the issue:

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-09-24/africans-relocate-to-alabama-to-fill-jobs-after-immigration-law

http://world.time.com/2012/09/20/what-if-rich-countries-shut-the-door-on-immigration/?xid=newsletter-europe-weekly

Jamila

That sounds like a solid and logical thought!  …Accepting that people who consume more than they produce have a net negative drain on society (economically speaking).  For me… from the Libertarian and economist side, I believe we need MASSIVE immigration!  We need people to come here and work really hard, get into the middle class, and pay lots and lots of taxes so we can pay for social security… Thirty-three Amigos and ten weed eaters are not boosting the nation’s GDP anywhere near where it needs to be to balance the budget. 

Social Safety nets are great, but they all fail when everyone is in the net… especially if there is no escape from the net… Social Safety nets should not be gill nets!

 CortlandCarrington "That sounds like a solid and logical thought!  …Accepting that people who consume more than they produce have a net negative drain on society (economically speaking)."

But the problem is this: These people will always exist--in fact, they have to. There are just some jobs that are necessary but are not highly valued in terms of financial compensation by the market. Because the market mechanism does not adequately price these services so that the people who do them can still make a living, the government has to step in to redistribute income and provide subsidies for them. At the least, I would think that the government has a responsibility to provide transitional assistance to those that are moving from low wage labor to higher wage labor. 

"We need people to come here and work really hard, get into the middle class, and pay lots and lots of taxes so we can pay for social security… "

Or, we could just raise taxes on the top 1% and that should about cover it. 

 Jamila  Exactly.

 Jamila Poor immigrants. Illegal immigrants or legal immigrants. This suggest that poor immigrants are a burden...As in they don't pay for their own meal. I think it's mistaken to tie new immigrants to entitlements as the majority of those "taxing" entitlements are good ole' red blooded Americans. 

I don't have any statistics or anything. I only have my own experiences to draw from, but from what I've seen immigrants today and certainly historically have worked very hard to help build this country. When they come, they come to work, they don't come to sit around because they could have done that wherever they came from. Maybe I am mistaken, but most poor immigrants are not refugees (say fleeing war or political persecution). They are people trying to make money to build a better and more stable life for themselves and their families. 

Immigrants also tend to be incredibly patriotic because it is the place they have pinned their hopes and dreams for their lives on. They see it as a land of opportunity. This is a generalization, but it is generally true. 

This is just something I believe strongly because of my experiences. The majority or poor immigrants who come to the US, legally or illegally, work. They work a lot, usually 2 or 3 jobs doing "sh*t" jobs even when they were respected professionals in their old country. Immigrants work. They work. And their taxes pay into the system too. 

 iHeartLove "This suggest that poor immigrants are a burden...As in they don't pay for their own meal."

Not all of them can afford to pay for their own meals, in a metaphorical sense. If the jobs they have provide wages which are too low to afford housing, meals, and other necessities then those people have to be subsidized in some way or else the places they live will turn into slums (or a slum-like environment). 

 Jamila I definitely don't see the immigrants' rights movement as a civil rights issue. Blacks were/are legal citizens of this nation and the rights that were guaranteed to us by the Constitution were being denied. The U.S. already accepts way more legal immigrants than any other country. We have to set the limit somewhere.

I'm probably going to sound real offensive about now. Latinos have managed to turn the immigration issue into an ethnicity issue when it really shouldn't be. They are just showing that they have more allegiance to their ethnicity regardless of national origin than their own country. I could understand being more concerned with your ethnicity inside your own country, but I don't understand spreading this concern to other nations at the expense of your own. If they're so concerned about the conditions in Mexico, then they need to go down to Mexico and do something about it. If most of the immigrants were Asian, black, or European; Latinos would not care about the immigration issue at all.

The US doesn't treat all immigrants the same.  If you are Cuban, you can stay in this country if you are able to get one foot on US soil; it's call "wet foot, dry foot".  How come that doesn't apply if you are Mexican or Guatemalan etc?  I feel all immigrants should be treated the same, no matter of country of origin.  Each one should have to reach the same guidelines.  

 ChristieRJohnson The U.S. made this policy during the Cold War when it was all about capitalist democracies vs. communist autocracies. The policy is probably outdated, but at least the people of Mexico live in a democracy. If you want to learn about bad treatment of immigrants, you should read up on all of the human rights violations Mexican law enforcement officials have committed against Guatemalan immigrants. Mexico is so busy wagging its finger at the U.S. for our immigration policies wanting to put off all of their poor on us, but they don't care to fix the reason why so many people are fleeing their country or improve their own treatment of immigrants. 

Tammy_GhaldenJamila

It’s a question I’ve asked for many years… it’s not that Mexicans are coming here, that is the problem… the real problem is why are Mexicans fleeing Mexico in droves and in a panic?  It’s not the drug problem… the drug problem is here just as much as it is in Mexico!   The real difference is that the government of Mexico is WAY more corrupt…