Question of the Week: Are We Going Too Far with the Encouraging Black Women to Date White Dudes?

NSpungen I think somebody doesn’t want anyone else stepping on their turf- if this is really a white woman.

zabeth It doesn't surprise me to be receiving such a response. It's a continued reflection of exactly what I pointed-out in my post. A closed-mindedness to think larger than oneself and look at the big picture of what's going on in this country when it comes to marriage, economics and male attitudes. It would be nice if we could evolve and get to the point of standing together as women. If I had the time I'd dig-up the news stories and research for you. If you're curious, you can certainly find it yourself through Google.

So is the answer for women to abandon the idea of marriage completely? And why should women teach men how to be better partners? You can demonstrate to people how you’d like to be treated in a relationship but ultimately women can’t show men how to be better men or partners.

Please also note this discussion isn’t JUST about WM or one particular group of men but about broadening BW’s options to all men. Also I think the video acknowledges economic and educational disparities hence why BW should broaden their dating and mating options.

NSpungen

zabeth Sorry, I missed this before closing-out my comments. Zabeth, I don't want to abandon the idea of marriage either. I'm also trying to figure it out. I think it's a sad state of affairs all around. I think life should be about love. And marriage provides an awesome opportunity to lift one another up to a completely different level spiritually and in our personal accomplishments. I wish more men saw it this way.

I think there's a major shift going on in our society. And statistics show marriage is heavily on the decline. More than 50% of people of marrying age remain single. I have a lot of ideas on why this may be. The simplest one being that I do think we as a society tend to not hold eachother accountable for actions, and that's made men feel it's ok to behave in certain ways, i.e. them so frequently wanting casual relationships and lots of hooking-up versus a relationship - it's male nature. I don't know if it would solve the problem, but I can't help but think it might at least help the situation if some women weren't so willing to put out.

I also blame it on the society we've become, one that encourages narcism with the likes of Facebook, Twitter and celebrity - which feeds a frenzy of "look at me" and collecting people, without building real relationships.

I think someone else may have commented somewhere that we should really just focus on finding love, no matter race. I subscribe to that. It's hard enough - so I guess that supports your comment Zabeth that yes, everyone should be open and expand their horizons. Perhaps it's just the way this is phrased and approached here.

There's an interesting article that was written by a 40 year old woman in NYC, on the decline of marriage as an option. I don't live her lifestyle and I don't subscribe to her attitude in general, but I thought the comments following it were interesting and there are some facts in the story that are legitimate. http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2011/nov/27/kate-bolick-women-marriage-relationships?INTCMP=SRCH

Keeping the hope and keeping the faith that love is still possible.

NSpungen Too late to clean it up. You introduced yourself the first time when you commented here and I'm taking a quote from Maya Angelou, when ppl tell you who they are, believe them. You've already told us who you were the first time, we believe you. zabeth

Hmmm....well....well...well... zabeth NSpungen

Christelyn zabethNSpungen They don't stop, do they, they just won't stop. Who am I supposed to standing with, who exactly. Why she's over here lecturing us, why don't she go somewhere and stand with wm it's all like that. The last thing any of us need is some ww who's covered by privilege and protected telling me to stand with some folks who could give a damn and have shown themselves not to give a damn whether I lived or died. GTFOHWTBS

You know what's crazy? A LOT of white women DO read this blog. They email me ALL THE TIME. We are being observed. eugeniamitchell zabeth NSpungen

Christelyn eugeniamitchellzabethNSpungen

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg195/scaled.php?server=195&filename=captainpicardoohgirln13.jpg&res=medium

hahaha

Christelyn I'm sure they're watching but I'll be a fool on Sunday if I let one of these 'privileged' broads come and lecture me on standing with bm especially when they don't care to stand with me. Yea not today or any other day, I just didn't fall off the turnip truck. I must say she has a lot of nerve. zabeth NSpungen

Christelyn eugeniamitchellzabethNSpungen Actually, I stumbled across this site the other day, it came up in my Google alerts for something entirely different. So don't worry, I'm not here observing you. Just couldn't help but comment when I happened upon this because it's just so out of touch.

As far as assuming someone is privileged because of the color of their skin, it's an age old mistake. Not everyone within a single ethnicity is created equal. My ancestors all fled Russia in 1900, when Jewish people were being mass murdered. The lucky ones got on a boat, not knowing where it was headed and made it out with the clothes on their backs. My family was all poor immigrants who arrived here long after slavery had ended. And I happen to grow-up in the poorest neighborhood in my school district alongside blacks and asians, (those were my friends growing-up), where murders happened from time to time and with divorced parents and a father that refused to pay child support. And I've been working my butt off for everything I have since then.

I realize that only one of you in this thread made this accusation, but we all know this is common and I tell you it's merely a cause of division, which is really a shame because growing-up I related more to the people who I grew-up with - minorities. And I believed to the core in fairness for everyone and no prejudice. My background is probably why I work on social causes for a career.

So really, I'm on your side as a woman and as a human being. I'm one of the people that will be protesting alongside you for what's right and fair, should you already be or ever become civically involved. Go ahead and take your critique at what I've said. I made the point I came here to make earlier, and that's all I came here to do. So I'm out, no more commenting from me. Peace be with you.

NSpungen No you're not on my side and you're out of touch. You have white skin privilege and to deny it shows you how out of touch you are. This world revolves around white skin, you can change your name and Americanize yourself which I'm sure your family did and get things that I as a educated, decent bw will never have access to. You are privileged and protected. You telling me something about relating to minorities means nothing, now you're being patronizing. It's as you just said 'well I have black friends' that's what you don't get. All of us bw on here live in this skin, many of us have seen the results of what is happening with blk families and children b/c we're part of those families. This just didn't start when the recession started, it's been going on and blk women have overcome and many of us have moved up and out of dysfunctional families and neighborhoods. How dare you ask us to go back, if we can do it bm should be able to do it too and not while walking on our backs. If you cared about bw like you pretend you do, you'd be behind us when we look out for the best interest of our ourselves and our offspring. We just don't talk about wm on here, we talk about good men and if you'd actually take the time to read this and not get your panties all in a bunch over one article if you'd think critically you'd know. This is a good thing for women to make sure that they are getting the help and aid that most other women in this country enjoy w/o having to beg for it, from whoever is the best candidate color be damned. There's no prejudice here, there's bw looking out for bw's interest which you, bm and no one else seems to have on their minds. Take your dog and pony show somewhere else, no one here is buying tickets. Christelyn zabeth

http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm198/RonSaunders/EBAY-MARCH%202011-VINYL%20ALBUMS/EBAY-MARCH2011VINYLALBUMS100.jpg ForestElfQueen

Aabaakawad cool!! :D here's an iPhone snap of the aforementioned pic

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/2441/sealsfamily.jpg

ForestElfQueen

"but there was an air of laziness about them, as if I should be thrilled to be in their presence"......this is so true, I wanted to laugh at this but the ignorance and "tomfoolery" is so sad

glamdoll lol! I can laugh now but it was like OMG. "oh nooooo! *I'm* supposed to be the prize!" One guy had the nerve to call me weeks later like at 8:00 pm asking if I wanted to come over and watch a movie at his place? WTH?!

I could tell that because he was relatively attractive with certain traits that some women had been putting up with major tomfoolery just to bask in his glory. Not I.

I had to hit the eject button on those rascals QF&IAH. To be fair, there was one English guy who thought he was hot stuff too. He got Next'd @ date zero too.

There are just too many men on the planet to settle for idiocy.

BM, other races don't have books ect? What about "Coloring Outside the Lines?" written by a white woman married to a Korean man. Hmmm...but okay. No other race may not discuss this as much as black women do, but that's because the black community dumps so much guilt on black women to hold it down within their race, but you already know that.

Christelyn Seriously, who are these ridiculous people creeping in here all late and wrong with their nonsense.

I think it has something to do with the new set up. People can see all the people reading and I think some folks are getting nervous...;-) Toni_M

Christelyn LOL! I love that we can see who is creeping and we know if there are new comments. Makes it much easier to call people on their BS.

Also, notice he was talking about no other race "advertises" this much about IRR as black women. Now we all know that the NBAB brigade has been so loud, that many WM just assumed that BW weren't interested. This has been the popular stance for ages.

But suddenly waves are being made and OMG it's too much? Hmm, I wonder.

I think it's hilarious though that rather than concentrate their energies on reassuring BW who are dedicated to the NBABisms, they're here talking to us. Like we care.

Those poor "nothing-but a brotha" women. They were trampled on the way to any woman that wasn't black and now they're getting trampled on the way to any black woman looking to date interracially.

Christelyn There's also _Breeding Between the Lines: Why Interracial People are Healthier and More Attractive_ by Alon Ziv (not mixed race himself)

http://breedingbetweenthelines.com/author.htm

http://www.amazon.com/Breeding-Between-Lines-Interracial-Attractive/dp/1569803064

whoops! That should read, "Kissing Outside the Lines" haha

Christelyn I'm glad you had a more respectful response. This can be a very heated topic in the black community. The black community does come down hard on black men for dating white women. Black comedians make fun of it, black leaders talk about. Black women were always seen as someone who was strongly against interracial dating especially when black men did it with white women. Many articles and discussions by black women about black men being with white women are written. Its still a big issue in the USA but why the need to push black women so much to do this. It seems like black women are desperate to get a white man. Love comes natural and not by force. Look what happened to Emmit Till. It still didn't stop black men for dating white women. Asian women are crazy for white men but they don't need anyone to tell them to date white men.

But...BM, although you are entitled to your opinion, why does it bother you so--this "advertising" of interracial relationships. What about it sticks in your craw? BM

I don't have a problem at all with this. I just hate hearing the awful comments towards black men for dating other races like its a crime. Have you seen the site boycottblackmen.com? A lot of black women feel that way on that site. They say black men are brainwashed, self hate, afraid of a strong black woman for dating a white women which comes from black women but then you see the same black women pushing towards white men. Its like a double standard. Thats my main problem. On youtube black women made videos trashing black men being with white women while at the same time telling black women to date out. See the problem? Why does this happen? Christelyn

Well, the You Tube is a two-way street when it comes to bashing. Personally, I think that all the dysfunction, non-marriage and out-of-wedlock births have led to BM and BW being extremely frustrated with one another. More on this tomorrow. BM

BMChristelyn ....Did you just LIE?

How do you go from "I do think so (in response to the question). No other race has this much advertisements and marketing telling them to date other races." to "I don't have a problem at all with this."

You can't have it both ways, you just can't come onto a site and accuse the membership of being angry at white women and dating white men for revenge, and then try and make it about how BW won't let BM date out while trying to do it themselves.

You ain't flipping the script on my watch.

This is not about why some "nuthin butta brotha black women" are "angry and bitter" and always hate on you and your non-white girlfriend. Because none of the women here are about that. And it was extremely rude of you to make that assumption without bothering to know anything about this site or community. Not all black women are alike and not all of us actually care about you dating out. Your life, your choice. Be happy!

But I always find it interesting that some people to whom this type of niche is not geared will try to come into this space, and make about themselves and their problems. This site isn't about the BM ego and not hurting your feelings by saying how we think and feel. If you don't like it, there are plenty of BM/WW-centric spaces for you to occupy.

Godspeed, and good luck; this is the last bit of attention I'm directing at you and your issues.

BMChristelyn Why do people have to pop off like this while I'm on blogging hiatus? :(

BM

BM You're so vain. You probably think this site is about you.

Anyway, if you remain confused, the question was asked not because anyone cares about what BM think; it was asked in consideration for other non-BM.

I don't care about you and white women. I don't even KNOW you, and even if I did, it's your life isn't it? Go date whatever fat/not-fat woman you want. This site is about BW and the men who we are interested in, in addition to our OWN issues, wants, and needs.

Tell it to someone else.

Well, I kind of figured that would be the negative response even though I didn't write down anything negative. I can read what this is about. I also know I have a right to my opinion as long as its not disrespectful or using foul language. Why do I see black men mentioned in these comments? You have serious attitude problems. You sound like the ones who have self hate and the hypocrites. Did I say anything bad to you or did I hit a nerve and you know what I said was the truth. You basically are proving my point. You have so much anger. I'm saying that black women aren't ugly and other races do find them attractive but loves comes from the heart. The problem is? What in my first comment was a lie or you feel was made up nonsense. Usually when the truth is made known, your response is normal and in attack mode. By the way they were not fat which you also proved another point.

Which "you" are you referring? Can you please show me where in my comment you detect foul language, bitterness or anger? BM

Not you. Toni _M Christelyn

BM

*headdesk* I'm gonna take this point by point, since you wanna play dumb:

"Well, I kind of figured that would be the negative response even though I didn't write down anything negative."

You are full of as much crap as a city sewer. You subscribe to the undercover passive aggressive school of insults and gaslighting. You think because you don't call us bitches and hos, you can belittle our way of thinking and interacting, and you won't get called on it because at least you are overtly verbal abusive like less clever but obviously damaged males.

We've done this song and before, hon. You are not the first BM to show up and politely put us down and or try and put us into a box.

The point is...you don't run sh*t. Your "polite suggestions" and "observations" come across as another BM trying to come into our space and tell us what to think and how to act. And that dog just isn't going to hunt.

Just because you are not overt with your BS doesn't mean I have to thank you for not being uncouth. I'll call it as I see it, because that's just the way I am.

"You basically are proving my point. You have so much anger-"

No, what I have is a low threshold tolerance for bullsh*t. I also have no appreciation for the "tone argument". I am not gonna sugarcoat my response because I for one do not care for your good opinion. It means nothing to me.

I do care if you want to grind out the old "You are Angry Black Women (TM) and no non-BM is gonna want y'all because BW have attitudes" talking point. I'm not buying it, but I don't know how many young ladies are lurking here thinking your subliminal low blows "make sense". I'm calling you out because I don't appreciate having my intelligence insulted.

This site isn't about who black men date. Period. End of story. This isn't about white women "stealing our men". Damn, have them, ladies! I will pack your bag and drop you off at Becky Consuela Lucy Lu's house if that's what you want. Go for it!

Not giving a crap who someone else dates isn't "self-hate", it's being indifferent. I am indifferent to your life choices. What I'm NOT indifferent to is you trying to passively aggressively undermine our conversation which (in case you didn't get it) is simply not about you. It's about us.

Again, save it for someone else. No one here is buying it.

BM

Guess what????...you may find this hard to believe, but a lot of bw are not dating and marrying nonblack men out of hurt, anger and resentment.......it has nothing to do with the bm;) and btw we are not as pissed off at seeing bm with women of other races as some would like to believe,,,,we are living our own lives;)......shocking huh??????????????????

glamdollBM Exactly. It's kinda funny and sort of sad at the same time... @ grocery stores in the US, I've walked pass an Afro-guy with his Rainbelle(?..haha) and/or family and if I've split from my husband, the guy rarely speaks or has this shield of defense up, as if I'm going to jump on his back or say something foul. I almost always say hi to the woman if she seems neutral-to-friendly.

Inevitably, we all cross paths again in another aisle with my husband and/or children and the wife/gf & I will smile at each other again. At this point, the guy might greet us or just look weird.

I don't find this pattern so much in Europe.

I wish people would act like they have sense and manners & not make crazy assumptions. My family of origin already has reps from many countries/'races' so I'd be the last to pass out, snarl, or sprout fangs.

glamdollBM Hallelujah well said. We are indeed living our own lives. I must say a happy BW too.

BM May God help us BW get through all this hate as we pursue happiness. With the strength God gives us. You will not,can not steal what he has in store for BW and finding a suitable mate. Not every BW is stupid and they get it. We shall overcome. You know this is not about getting even. What this is about just scares you. Stop with the mind games I've been around too long for that. I don't hate you, but I do hate what you stand for.

SERIOUSLY!!! LOL =) MayDay

MayDay Thats great and all that. But frankly most Asian men are chicken shit cowards when it comes to dating black women.

We all know culture and society dictate people's behavior. With such pressure on careers and being "good" and down to earth, Asian men don't get a lot of chances to date and get themselves out there.

That's like me saying Black women are chicken shit cowards when it comes to being wives because why do black men leave them so much? =)

Nkosazana

Ricky TNkosazana

I knew there had to be something more to it than the cliched Asian men are less desiriable' or shy. Asian men and black women haven't even entered the IR dating markets like others have so that's why the numbers are lower. I know for black women, only in recent years have I heard a good number express a desire for nonblack men. I also suspect that there is a ton of pressure on Asian men to marry Asian women. Why? I've been approached by men of every single race a number of times and an Asian man only once.