TV Host Told Muhammad Ali He Had a “Philosophy of Despair”

TV Host Told Muhammad Ali He Had a “Philosophy of Despair”

What a shame. My father was such a huge Muhammad Ali fan. SMDH…

Author : Christelyn Karazin

Author's Website | Articles from

(Special thanks to Lilian for bringing this to my attention)

 

What you are about to see is the root of the black nationalist movement coming out of Muhammad Ali’s mouth. A man who “loved” himself so much he bragged about being “yellow and pretty,” and showing disdain and teasing Joe Frazier for being “dark” and “ugly,” on the WORLD stage. What you are about to see is the root of all the “us versus them” mentality that we still see today. Here lies why black some black women are so afraid to cross the color lines. This is why some little black children are deathly afraid of being called a “sell-out” or accused of acting white.

Indeed. A philosophy of despair.

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Christelyn 8739 pts moderator

 nadjia I have to co-sign. Him deriding another BLACK MAN about his darkness when he was SUPPOSEDLY SO ENLIGHTENED was hypocritical. This is a prime example of how black people often ignore the cruelty of colorism. It's okay if another black person--your supposed brother or sister--calls you a dark butt? Please.

DeepWater 2457 pts

No matter what anybody has to say to me, I WAS "THERE".  As far as I'm concerned Muhammed Ali (Casius Clay) is the best boxer in U.S. history.  PERIOD.   Prior to Sugar Ray Leonard and Mike Tyson (bad ass cats as far as I'm conerned), this is the greatest Olympian that I've ever seen in boxing, again, PERIOD.   My mind will not change, don't care what arguments are presented.  He changed our world, no matter what others think!!!!!!!!! There are no Black men like this in our "new" era.  I'm stickin' to my story.   He is/was "The Greatest"  PERIOD in boxing. No doubts, no backin' up.  STRAIGHT UP.  PERIOD.  He was his own man, we don't see that now, often.  My here, FOREVER......

MixedUpInVegas 1650 pts

 Deepwater Horizon

 I don't remember anyone saying he wasn't a great boxer.

AnInterestedObserver 1029 pts

 Deepwater Horizon 

 

 

I agree with you. It was great to see a Black man, and a POWERFUL/FAMOUS Black man at that, be in support of only dating Black women. A breath of fresh air and something that NEEDED to be said.

 

Thank you Ali.

HarlemGirl 216 pts

I remember my dad loved Ali.  This interview was the early 1970's? just after civil rights? people still had those mindsets ( and in secret conversations some still do today) . I think we have to keep in mind  the era Ali was born in, alot of black and whites had that "stick to your own kind" attitude. He is 70 so he saw alot of  discrimination I am sure that gave him that opinion. If he had said this  today, his boxing career would be shot. things have changed in the last 40 years so I wonder if he feels that way now, or maybe he still does.

Grace80 204 pts

 HarlemGirl Meh don't care. Mum was born in Aparthied South Africa (As was I, but she lived it truly) and never said a bad thing about mixed couples nor my marriage.. And she spent most of her life serving white people in big houses while coming home to a tin shack. But then again she is a real Christian.

The Working Home Keeper 6592 pts

 Grace80  HarlemGirl My own parents lived through Jim Crow in the South.  But even with that experience, they didn't raise us to have a disdain towards white people.  And they had no problems with their daughters dating/marrying IR.

The_Boss 283 pts

 The Working Home Keeper

 That's not very common. That's unusual, in a good way. Because blacks in America were treated badly by the majority of white people back then, they developed a seperatist stance. For exaple, my grandmother has a deep seated and very reasonable distrust of white people based on her own experiences and fears. However, she only has nice things to say to friendly people who aren't of color today.

ann4950 732 pts

My Grandmother who is probably older than your Mom also lived through alot of oppression and worked only in white peoples' houses- she never said one bad word about another culture of people, same goes for my parents. My Dear Africans were not always Christian- insert whatever religion of your choice. Religious sobs are the worst. God is the only Supreme Being that can judge human kind.

HarlemGirl 216 pts

 ann4950 The Working Home Keeper Grace80  In these conversations we have to remember that everyone responds to their experiences differently somehow we think because our mother, grandmother, great great great great grandmother, etc acted a certain way therefore everyone's response  should be this this way, it is not. I simply addressed why Muhamad Ali may have responded this way, I did not say everyone born in his generation reacted that way, I did say some still carry those mindsets today ( I rented a guest house from a WW in the late 90's who said loudly she felt people should marry within their own race) , but things have progressed in the last 40 years since Muhamad did that interview. No two people respond to the same situations the same way, some let it make them bitter, some let it make them better.

Skayi 505 pts

This is so weird seeing the black man in the ignorant role. Come on Mr. Ali were you really this stupid.

zipporah 1714 pts

@Skayi Heey it was 1971---I think hes changed now...and others on this site put a link up to his IRISH ancestors..oh and BTW. Most Black peoples white blood comes straight from 'county cork' anyway, IF we dont look Latin (spanish-french) few italians were here then

Patricia Kayden 1673 pts

Can't see Ali's comments, but as you know, he comes from a mixed background. One of his Grandfathers is an Irishman who married an African American freed woman. I wonder where he got the idea that like stays with like when he has an interracial relationship in his background. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/sep/01/muhammad-ali-freedom-ennis-ireland

Lili2009 1826 pts

 Patricia Kayden I love the PBS show with Dr. Henry Louis Gates. He takes pleasure in surprising African-American celebs saying that their male or female ancestor actually married a white person way back when. Wanda Sykes was told that her male ancestor married a white woman and that Wanda's people were free and not slaves. Gates asked her, "if you could speak with this ancestor today, what would you say?" Wanda just quipped that she would introduce him to HER white wife! Love Wanda!

zipporah 1714 pts

@Patricia Kayden Where do you think we got tapdancing from anyway? its afro-celt along with the term 'mammy'--both my parents have irish last names, they could have came frome slavery, or maybe not..irish women and some men were 'enslaved' by the english for YEARS

grrlysquirrel75 1121 pts

 zipporah Both my grandmothers had Irish maiden names and my maternal grandmother's father was half white so more than likely I have some Irish ancestry.

ann4950 732 pts

Interesting, you learn something new every day. I am sure Ali is proud of his great grandparents.

DeepWater 2457 pts

The "Rumble In The Jungle" Ali/Foreman, 1974, and "The Thrilla In Minalla"  Ali/Frazier, What can I say?  What can say?    We WATCHED both of these,  these fights were watched worldwide on ABC's (now defunct) "Wide World of Sports", Howard Cosell (bit of a dirtbag, but great "call" announcer at the time) and Ali were the yin and yang of boxing.

 

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was 1971 in above tape, and sadly, that was some of the thinking then, I'm sure he's grown (evolved) from this mindset........Parkinson's has, sadly, taken hold now) and he may look back with some regret with above statements.  However, some of us do talk out the side of our necks sometimes............BWAAAHAAA.

 

Back to "The Greatest"...................THE MAN WAS HUGE, MY HERO. in the ring.  He could talk more smack than ANYONE, and I do mean, ANYONE.  This man flew with "his team" to Kinshasa, Africa,  Africa y'all,  this was, I believe, one of the greatest (boxing) sports moments in HISTORY.   Man oh man, my family and our friends sat down, broke out the popcorn & coca-cola (adults beer/drinks) and watched history before our very eyes.  George Foreman was not a joke, 1st time, we saw "fear" in Ali's eyes, no joke, we knew he'd have to "stomp" this "some gun".   All the biggest stars from all over the world were there, the men dressed more "beautiful" than the women attending (lol).  These were 15-round bouts back then, no longer (most likely quickening the pace of Parkinson's disease).  Ali beat Foreman in the 8th round with a left body shot and right fist to the head.  Knocked Foreman out.  Straight up, ya heard, yeah buddeeeeeeee,  BWAAAAHHHAAAAAAA.

 

I'm sorry about him "spouting off at the mouth" as usual, which was his style, with some ignorant mess, however, that was him doing his "piss off White folks" thing to garner up support.  Not cool, in retrospect, however, he spoke VOLUMES in the ring.  

 

"The Greatest"...............................................................................

ann4950 732 pts

Christlyn, what made you bring that old '70s video up? That video was part of that era. Ali and sports announcer Howard K. Cosell was very good friends. They both respected each other. In the 60s and 70s racial issues were always on the front burner and that is why Ali was speaking in that tone of voice. Ali was and still is a very intelligent man, he knew what he was doing. Before, Ali converted he dated an assortment of other race women. I truly believe he does not feel the same way as he did in the 70s and the same for wm of that era.

MixedUpInVegas 1650 pts

Hallelujah!  I got on the site!  My sisters in the gender, I have been jonesing really bad for your wise words and sharp insights.

 

Now, on to Casius Clay . . er . . What's-his-name.  I'll bet he's regretting those remarks today.  He clearly never knew either of my husbands.  My late husband proudly dispalyed our family pictures in his office, and often brought our daughter to his office, since he would pick her up from the Catholic school she attended nearby.  My current husband and I have no children together (that ship had already sailed by the time we met) but he has introduced me to his family and collegues and one rarely goes out in public without the other.

 

He looks like a raving fool in that video--thanks for posting it. 

 

 

Lili2009 1826 pts

Showed this to husband and he really bristled at the notion that a white person wouldn't (or shouldn't) be proud to be seen with their black spouse or child in public. I heard a radio interview with the author who also advocated for black women to expand their world view and options. A black man called in and said that he's noticed that white men do not put the picture of their black wives or children on their desk at work (this echoing the same attitude that white men do not have pride in their choice of black woman as a wife.) This sentiment was expressed in 2010. So, in 1971 Ali's very strident opinion about racial categories, "like stays with like", is still around. But, looking at the stats, who is really buying that line?  

Grace80 204 pts

 Lili2009 I know right.. My husband is out and about all the time with his children.. He has never been ashamed to take me out. Husbands office is full of children and wedding photos. Actually he says it's a great conversation starter with clients.

Christelyn 8739 pts moderator

Hubby has me and the kids pictures plastered all over this office. He says it get him more business with the black ladies. lol!

The Working Home Keeper 6592 pts

 Grace80 Same here!  My husband has pictures of me and the kids, the kids artwork, he's taken us to his office and introduced me and the kids to his coworkers.  My husband is definitely not trying to hide the fact he's married to a black woman and has half black kids.  My husband is quite proud of his family :)  My MIL even has plenty of pictures of us and the kids at home and her office.

Christelyn 8739 pts moderator

 Lili2009 That line got me too.

Jamila 7215 pts moderator

 Lili2009 "A black man called in and said that he's noticed that white men do not put the picture of their black wives or children on their desk at work (this echoing the same attitude that white men do not have pride in their choice of black woman as a wife.) "

 

There is a black woman author--I can't think of her name--that is married to a white man and has two kids with him. I've seen her comments online and spoken to her before. She said that she does not allow her husband to put up pictures of her and their kids because she is afraid it might jeopardize his job. I found that interesting, considering this day and age. 

Lili2009 1826 pts

 Jamila Interesting! I guess in my husband's field it's a non-issue. It has actually been a conversation starter where men say they either dated a black woman or have a relative married to someone black. And unfortunately, a bunch of white people (or black people) together may think they have some comfort in the group enough to spout racist stuff. So, my picture kind of removes the awkwardness of a situation like that.

 

grrlysquirrel75 1121 pts

 Lili2009 Jamila That's very interesting. A man here in my office (who happens to be Australian) is married to a Black woman and has two sons with her. There are pictures of them all around his work area. She also works for our company too, but in a different division.

Karla 18226 pts

 Lili2009 My hubs has a photo of me on his desk as well.  He said he likes looking at something beautiful in his office.  He also said it has, inadvertently, let him know who's who.  Most people comment favorably, some say nothing and a couple have said, "I didin't know your wife was African American!"  One guy was truly surprised but the other was very disapproving.  In so many words, he said he didn't believe the races should mix.  Hubs told him where to go, he was shocked, end of story.  Luckily, they don't work together and now never see each other (hubs was promoted).

Lili2009 1826 pts

 Karla Baby is toooo cute!!!! She's gorgeous, too. Well, I guess whatever daddy's opinion now, I hope they're all satisfied!

Karla 18226 pts

 Lili2009 Yes, in this case, genetics will out.  She's not "yellow", didn't marry a "yellow" man and the baby is certainly not "yellow".  What is it with some BP, who think they're an armchair Gregor Mendel?  Get over it!

Grace80 204 pts

Still amazed that people converted to Islam to be more 'African'.. I don't think people at the time knew what their so called brothers think of them.. Just last week I heard a bunch of North Africans called a Gambia man the K word several times in front of him and me. But then again N Africans are ****ed up. Even the Somali guy I spoke to last week said that.

Lili2009 1826 pts

 Grace80 I have a cousin who is, sadly, in and out of prison and on his first stint in prison, he studied up on Islam and I think he's going to convert. I don't know enough to understand why this conversion is more authentic for black men than any other faith.

Brenda55 19415 pts moderator

 Lili2009  Grace80 Authentic? No.

Protection while incarcerated? Yep. Most jailhouse conversions are more to keep the newly "saved" alive rather than salvation.

Grace80 204 pts

 Lili2009 You know what's funny.. A cake gets more attention in the news than this. A cake causes more outrage this. 'Brothers' and 'sisters' in faith... Modern day slavery more like but no one cares.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYn_dkMJGDU

Jamila 7215 pts moderator

 Grace80  Lili2009 I saw that video a while ago and was considering making a post on it. 

 

Maxine 1005 pts

 Grace80 Youtube has removed the video for "shocking and disgusting" content.  ???  And what's the K word?  

Grace80 204 pts

 Maxine *shrugs* I guess people think it offensive to show what black women goes thru. If this was in America, people would riot like the Rodney King video. But a black woman outside America is not worth much to anyone.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/apr/09/alem-dechasa-ethiopia-lebanon

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_%28racial_term%29

 

Arab muslims makes a game out of it. They KNOW it's offensive, but they say it anyway and if anyone calls it on it they say it's just them speaking arabic. Not only me who says it, my friend from Cape Town says they are insufferable and do it all that time there.

Lady M 160 pts

 Grace80 Totally agree. Oddly enough, your quote on Arab Muslims reminds me of this YouTube clip from a while back of this racist white South African dude - with his equally racist ARAB YEMENI wife.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HF78v3B5yt8

 

It just goes to show that many Arabs have the same mentality as this man.

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Brenda55 19415 pts moderator

 Marcie "Why do people keep bringing up so much negativity of the past?"

 

Forget the past and be condemned to live it in the future. 

 

Sure people do evolve in their thinking.  That is what spaces like BB&W  an BWE bloggers are trying to effect on black women quite frankly.

 

Ali was always spouting off like that....mostly for effect. He could showboat with the best of them and guys like the interviewer ate it up. Ratings = revenue dear ratings = revenue.

 

I viewed the tape as an example of showing just how far we have come. For all of that crap coming out of the mouths of men and women like him there  ain't stopping growing numbers of us from ending up in the arms of the men we want. The problem has away been in our own heads, not what any one person could really physically do.

Toni_M 18805 pts moderator

 Brenda55  Marcie Thank you, Brenda55. Let us NOT forget his attitude, however it may have changed, did not die in the era with him.

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Lili2009 1826 pts

 Marcie It might be the past for Ali but these sentiments are still around (but if they are expressed by a white man or woman, they'd be accused of being a racist supremacist.)

 

ASwirlGirl 3031 pts

"Philosophy of despair," indeed. Just listening to the ignorance spouting out of his mouth is depressing.

Lili2009 1826 pts

Wowzer. I can tell who was the product of American Racism and who wasn't!  That is some serious DBR thinking Ali is spouting. Did he change his mind eventually?

ann4950 732 pts

Ali's daughter, Jamillah, has married a Chicago lawyer who promotes young boxers in his spare time. Jamillah Ali, 39, married Michael Joyce, 42, last weekend at the Ritz-Carlton hotel in Naples, Fla., the Chicago Sun-Times reported Wednesday Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/05/19/Muhammad-Alis-daughter-marries/UPI-99761274280198/#ixzz1vhvLRXey Since we are going backward here is an old post that points a finger at bw: http://yeyeolade.wordpress.com/2010/05/28/shahrazad-ali-points-finger-at-black-women-for-helping-to-destroy-our-black-men-sisters-this-black-truth-is-bitter-but-we-must-stop-acting-like-imitation-white-girls-and-disrespecting-our-black/