Ladies, Do NOT Date Interracially if You’re Too Suspicious of White Men. Please. Just…Don’t. (Letter)

A non-black man just sent me the email below regarding an exchange he had with a black woman on OKCupid that he found attractive. This woman is so defensive, so quick to try and discover closet racism, quick to start a fight, and suspicious of whether or not she’s being fetisized.

worst-selfie

Can I just say something? I wish the level of suspicion and vetting some black women undertake and the hoops they expect non-black men to jump through and eggshells they have to step on could equal that of what you do for black men. Then maybe we wouldn’t have a ridiculous out-of-wedlock rate. Yep; I said it. Some of you grill white men more than you’d ever do a black guy, and honestly if you’re that wary and that suspicious, stay in your lane and date what you know. Because you’re making it harder for other black women, okay? Just go call Tyrone. Nobody will judge you. Promise.

Here’s the letter:

Let me tell you about my adventure with online dating that I had this evening.

I saw I had a mutual like on OK Cupid. It said we are a 96% match. I decided to send her a message. I told her that she was a tall drink of water (she is 5’11″). She said she was a liberal news junkie. I told her I thought only pubs were news junkies, well at least faux news. I told her I enjoyed reading her profile.

She wrote back and thanked me. She said she thought that some of the questions they ask were odd and did I think they backed people into a corner. I told her some of them did and that I often ignored the weird ones, but I would answer them some times. I told her what really gets me is that I only date black wome yet when they send me matches they send a lot of white women and only a few black women.

She then proceeded to ask me why do I feel the need to keep saying that over and over again(it is mentioned ONCE in my profile). She then asks if it is a preference or am I being derogatory towards my mother. Then she says she is a straight forward person and she hopes I don’t find this offensive. Then comes Claire Huxtable with let the record show that she took offense to a joke I made about CPT. Then she says she is never late, her friends and family are never late and that just because the people I dealt with are on CPT that does not make the stereotype true. She said her and her family are successful and that the CPT comment was not funny to her.

I told her I like to laugh and joke. I said I don’t date black women as some type of badge. I told her she knew nothing about me, but she wants to be an amateur psychologist and tell me that I may be saying derogatory things about my mother. I told her CPT was funny to me and many people I knew. I told her it’s not about “the people you dealt with are always late” as she put it. I told her to me CPT is as funny as white people drinking with their pinkies out. I told her if she is that up tight that she should take up a hobby and unwind. I wanted to tell her she needed something else, but I was trying to be nice. I told her she was the only person I knew that ever took offense to the CPT thing and that she needed to take her big brain and find a sense of humor.

She said that I should stop taking digs at her and asked why was I angry. I told her I was not angry. Big brain was meant as a compliment. I told her that her profile said she was a project manager and that I had never seen a project manager who was dumb.

The things we endure to try and find a relationship.

Can you count how many ways this woman vagina-blocked herself?  Vetting and inquires come at appropriate levels, and there is an etiquette. Being quick to be offended just isn’t sessie. That level of grilling is JUST like someone on the very first date saying they want to get married in x years, and want to have x children, and asking the guy ON THE FIRST DATE if he’s marriage minded. It’s like turning in your employment to potential employer how much money they pay and how soon can you get a vacation before they even know if they want to interview much less hire you. Yeah. It’s just like that.

I’m SMH at some of the women on the fan page trying to defend they’re right to grill non-black in in the first initial email. Go head girl. Just don’t send me an email about how online dating just isn’t working for you.

So to be clear (because I’m a little frustrated that people are trying to say I’m telling black women to just take whatever crap, here’s my advice on the levels of vetting in online dating:

–Read the initial email from your suitor. Check to see if he actually read your profile and isn’t just spamming and playing the numbers.

–Review his profile. Does he have potential? No? Don’t respond, block and delete and move on. He he does have potential, send a cheerful, light response note.

–After about the third email, the guy should be trying to make plans to meet. If he just wants to play on email and texts, cut bait.

–If there is a first date, don’t initially GO IN on the whole race issue. This is a time for you to get to know each other, not your ancestors. Talk, but also LISTEN. You can get a lot of information by just listening. Bigots and weirdos can’t wear the mask for long before they reveal themselves.

–ETA because now I’ve gotten some sleep: White guys the discussion of race shouldn’t come up from YOU either. You’re trying to get to know this woman as an individual, not a collective. Keep the discussion focused on the two of you. Inserting race, racial jokes etc at an initial contact could doom you from the gate.

236 comments
haleyantoinette
haleyantoinette

I wish the level of suspicion and vetting some black women undertake and the hoops they expect non-black men to jump through and eggshells they have to step on could equal that of what you do for black men. Then maybe we wouldn’t have a ridiculous out-of-wedlock rate. Yep; I said it. Some of you grill white men more than you’d ever do a black guy, and honestly if you’re that wary and thatsuspicious, stay in your lane and date what you know. -----

-You spoke a Word there...maby people ask me why I am single with no children and my response is always I deserve to be more than some BM's baby mama! Know your worth and you want ever settle for less than you deserve.

Harold13
Harold13

Just joined livefyre so that I could comment and not just read. I think she was reading more into it than what was actually there. Of course I could be wrong.

BreannaNouveaux
BreannaNouveaux

Not going to lie, this was cringe worthy.

As I said on Christelyn's page on FB, I simply do not respond to men who come off as choco-fiends lol. Now, I like admiration and all but when its on this white-brotha- Robin Thicke level, I have to pull a Paula and jump ship.

As for her, is she sure she wants to swirl cause sistagirl was trippin..

Heidi49
Heidi49

Wow, reading this made me uncomfortable and I wasn't the one talking to this women. She clearly has an issue with a past relationship with a man who let her down. She is not ready to date and needs to take some more time to heal and get herself in order before she hits the dating scene. I would suggest that you leave her alone at this time and move on. But to you as you don't know her making the comment about CPT or Colored People's Time may have been offensive to her as people of color are seen as being late and lazy even to this day. So racial jokes are never cool, until you are with a person who is comfortable with themselves and you.  Keep things light and simple when dating online and don't get personal until you meet each other in person, then you can see the body language of how your words are setting with a woman any woman and you can gage from there what words should be spoken. 

JolieMelodie
JolieMelodie

 Can I just say something? I wish the level of suspicion and vetting some black women undertake and the hoops they expect non-black men to jump through and eggshells they have to step on could equal that of what you do for black men. Then maybe we wouldn’t have a ridiculous out-of-wedlock rate. Yep; I said it.

Best part of the article. Harsh truth.

ShunJack
ShunJack

Stereotypical jokes could be off-putting to some people. But I disagree with most of the comments saying he should repress...the whole point of dating is to weed out the people that don't fit you. I think he should continue to be himself and when he bumps into the one woman who gets his sense of humor, it could make for a perfect match.

ladyofmagic1974
ladyofmagic1974

I know that I am late chiming in on this but both of them were wrong.  She came off a bit defensive and seems to grill him on practically everything.  He was wrong on making that CPT joke.  He failed to realize that not all people of color will tolerate a joke like that.

LovelyLulu
LovelyLulu

Oh, dear, I think both of them contributed to this trainwreck.  She should not have been rude to him simply because he stated his preference.  Not even sure why she brought up his mother either - that bit was just weird.  All this was really unnecessary on her part.

She was already overly suspicious so the CPT joke probably did not help.  People who know you finding that kind of joke funny does not mean strangers will appreciate it.  Especially since things get lost in translation in writing.  I personally would not have found it funny. 

Then it just spiralled.  One, or both of them should just have nexted the other and moved on.  Basically a bunch of fail all around.   

dani-BBW
dani-BBW

I am not able to read the whole exchange or comments right now but I would be unnerved and a little creeped out if some guy I didn't know threw out CPT IN AN INITIAL EXCHANGE with me on a dating site.


O_O

KalEl72
KalEl72

Was I wrong for CPT? Yes I can admit that. Am I a Twinkie Boy (whatever the hell that is) or a douche? No! I use CPT because I find ALL stereotypes funny. They are funny to me because they are untrue. All black guys play basketball. Not true. All Asians have big brains. Not true. All Latinos live in a house with 20 family members. Not true. All whites like mayonaise or something else stupid. Not true. Stereotypes are funny because when we hear them we think of someone who fits that stereotype. Just because a few do this or that does that mean they all do? No! Republicans think all Democrats are against guns and God. Not true. Democrats think all Republicans carry Bibles and shotguns. Not true. To me making people laugh or trying to make people laugh is a great way to break ice. Obviously with her I broke the wrong ice, but hey life goes on. I did have a nice conversation the other day with a young lady at lunch. She was my server and I noticed she had natural hair and I complimented her on it. She was shocked that I knew about natural hair. When you have helped a woman put weave in, helped a woman put a relaxer in, combed hair food into a young ladies hair and had to use different sprays and gels in your daughters hair you tend to know a little about hair. So yes the CPT comment will be taken away from  whatever question I answered it with. Maybe I will edit it and then let Christelyn and you guys look at it to see how it sounds.

Peaches2170
Peaches2170

@haleyantoinette Good for you Haley. You sound like a smart girl (no offense by 'girl' - I just feel much older than you- I'm 43- so you look young enough to be my precious little daughter -smile).  I'm proud of your stand!!  And don't let no one turn you otherwise. My experience with black men has been - for the most part- negative.  The last date I had about 2 months ago- took me to dinner, bought me flowers (b/c I told him to- I've learned you have to 'TEACH' most black men how to treat you as a woman). However, after dinner, he bent down to kiss me on the lips- pulling away I'm thinking, "Hey, we don't even know each other yet to be kissing on the lips like that".  I gently told him that we need to stay focused on getting to know each other a little more first.  Well, he looked really disappointed and never called me again.  Found out later- he's separated from his wife. So, I felt that initially, I was a potential 'booty-call' to relieve him from his 'drought' period. WOW!!!  But This has been quite typical of many black dates.  So sad.  


So, keep your stand baby- you're not missing nothing. There's a really special and nice guy out there designed just for you. 

Gijou
Gijou

@haleyantoinette Hmmmm maybe the reason that WM are being "grilled" by these ladies who supposedly "want" to date them has to do with their own insecurities (not that this is right) . . .  that is the only thing that makes any sense to me!


Just a thought . . . people have done more screwed up things . . . . 

haleyantoinette
haleyantoinette

Lol...just saw my mistakes!

"Know your worth and you won't ever settle for less than you deserve!"

Justme65
Justme65

@ladyofmagic1974 


I am also late to this one, but I have no doubt the ladies here have covered what I would have said, including everything you said.

CPT isn’t a good term for WM to use. White people shouldn’t use phrases/terms that they have only heard in the BC unless they are completely familiar with the term.   I wonder if this young man even knows that it stands for Colored People’s Time?   I even thought that the term had been upgraded to BPT.

This woman needs to take some time.   That was a true grilling she gave this man and instead of going in like that she should have dismissed herself from someone that is obviously not for her.   I do think I would’ve said, in a kind way, that his comment is something he may not want to repeat, especially to black people he doesn’t know.

Otherwise, all of the other comments she made seems to make it obvious that she is hypersensitive to a man doing her wrong in some way…and all she’s trying to do is prove it to herself.

Obviously, the guy doesn’t know what he said wrong about the “CPT” thing and it does need to be brought to his attention because, in his mind, he just thought he was trying to be “down” with BW.   I also think that there is more to the story than what he is telling.

Dude ain’t so clean.  He said, “Then comes Claire Huxtable with let the record show that she took offense to a joke I made about CPT.”   Really dude?  Claire Huxtable?!!!    Would this dude use her as a way to describe (what I think he is saying) a “goodie-goodie” to non-black women?    OMG!!!!!

I’m sorry y’all.   I have only dated IR in California.   I have never had a non-black guy even mention my race at all at first.He dates me as any other race of woman, and if it comes up, it comes up and we make comments on it, deal with it, and move on.Of course, it isn’t as easy as that, but let’s meet each other as people, or man and woman, before race.


WM, when a womansays, as this man said, she is “a straight forward person and she hopes you don’t find this offensive”, she means that she will be saying how she really feels without regard to your feelings.Let’s hope you listen up.Sometimes this is good, but most times it’s bad, really bad.Not all BW are tactless, but the ones who are show themselves upfront and make no excuses for being so.


Well, onto reading the other comments.


KalEl72
KalEl72

That is just it. I didn't throw it out there. In the questions section I used it to explain an answer I gave. She says I kept mentioning over and over about dating black women and I only mention it ONCE. I mention it in the last section of the profile. It asks "Contact me if......." Part of my answer was "you are a black or bi-racial woman."

Public123
Public123

@KalEl72 

You may not be wrong, but what's funny to one person may be offputting to someone else.  And what's funny to them may not be funny to you.  That's not bad, it's just life.  Not everyone is a good match, even if a computer algorithm asserts you would be.


So don't bait and switch people.  Your style of humor is your style, and you should be using it as weed-out tool, just like your potential matches do.

It's just wasting yours and the other person's time to present yourself one way on paper, but then later do the big reveal.  

Do you, have a profile that accurately reflects who you are and how you roll, stick to women who like what that means.  You should leave the CPT comment in, unless you plan to remove it from your vocabulary 100%. As well as your racial preferences.

Otherwise you are doing a bait and switch, when you should be weeding.


I say this as someone who completely 100% hates sarcasm, racial humor, butt-of-joke humor, and teasing, and would have mixed feelings about people who have strong preferences for races that are not their own.


But I do a lot of online dating, a lot of IR dating, very successfully.   The first key is to recognize that although my preferences and concerns are right for me, they're not universally right.  

The second key is that all parties need to be upfront in their profile about who they are. 


A guy's not a bad person just because we're not compatible, but I'd like us to know ASAP if we're not a good fit, especially if it's something that will be a huge problem for me.

The guy shouldn't have a bad time with a woman who doesn't appreciate him, but that's what he'd get from me if the profile is the Photoshopped image of who he really is. 






Geekette221B
Geekette221B

@ KalEl72 Live and learn. You made a bad first impression. It happens. Next time, avoid the "stereotype" humor until you know that person better. It was too much too fast, so it came across as insensitivity plus entitlement. Slow down, and you'll be fine. Best of luck to you.

zipporah
zipporah

@KalEl72 love your USER NAME

SUPERMAN.....LOL--Kal El was his name before Clark Kent

either you were born in 72 or someone from your family was.---although i could be wrong.

haleyantoinette
haleyantoinette

@Gijou @haleyantoinette True! That's why it's important that we know our worth and love our individual selves before we enter into a relationship all broken and looking for someone else to make us whole...


KalEl72
KalEl72

The Claire Huxtable reference was for "let the record show". That was one of her favorite and best lines to use. I was not trying to use her as a "goodie-goodie" reference. I am not trying to be "down" with anyone. I am who I am. I have never heard the expression BPT. Maybe it's just a difference of California and the South. I never heard a Californian use y'all. This is a word I do not use. Even though I am from the South I use you guys. There isn't anything else to the story. Don't try to read the tea leaves on this one. I still have the entire exchange that I would be happy to share with you. Just for reference "read the tea leaves" simply means don't make a story where there isn't one. I just think the tea leaves thing sounds better.

cjdimplez
cjdimplez

@KalEl72 I wouldn't worry about it.  You live and learn.  Speaking as one who is familiar with this site, I will say this.  It is refreshing to know that you at least specified your preference in that section.  I have to to through the questions just to see if the ones I am interested in would even consider dating a BW.  I would rather know up front.  You will find the one that is just right for you.  :)

KalEl72
KalEl72

@Geekette221B Here is the part that gets me. I went and looked at my profile again. In the part about who should contact me I put black or bi-racial women and that is the ONLY time I mentioned dating black women. There is also a section hwere you answer questions for compatibility. I have answered 392 questions so far. 3 of them, yes only 3 bring up race. One asks about interracial marriage being a bad idea. Another asks about having kids with someone your own ethnicity being important and the last asked about prefering to go out with someone your own race/skin color. I answered no to them all. I just don't see where I am saying over and over again that I date black women. BTW I did remove the CPT thing. It was an explanation to a question.

zipporah
zipporah

@KalEl72 is that you daughter? or your niece? just saying since she looks biracial

although its not my business since i don't have a picture with my username....LOL

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 


“Let the record show” I do not know you any more than you know me. That being said, it is not necessary to get hypersensitive about what someone you don’t know says.

I was born in Georgia to Georgian parents and from time to time I use “y’all”. Not sure what the problem is there.   Lots of black people in California use “y’all”.

I am in no way trying to defend this woman, even though you are here to defend yourself and she is not.   There are two sides to every story.   I just know the CPT thing wasn’t cool and I guess you get that now.   Also, just my opinion, using stereotypes of people isn’t funny.   But hey, DO YOU.

I am quite bored with that whole issue though, if the other party isn’t here to give her side, and I would rather talk about something else you addressed in your letter.   It has to do with online dating.  Why do these sites send me pics of smiling BM, when I specifically stated I want non-black men? 

You said, “I told her what really gets me is that I only date black women yet when they send me matches they send a lot of white women and only a few black women.”

Why does this happen?   I don’t want to see majority BM answering my online dating requests, when I SPECIFICALLY asked for non-black men, especially if I’m on an IR dating site.   What are your thoughts or anyone else’s as to why?


SirLoinDeBeef
SirLoinDeBeef

@KalEl72 @Geekette221B 

First, for openers, I am a 71-year-old WM, long married to a lovely younger AA woman - I have never online dated and don't know how to 'text' - I doubt if I use my cell phone twice in a month.

IMO, you had the bad luck to connect with a black chick that had a 'my-race-first-last-and-always' chip on her shoulder.

Your error, simply put, was to continue texting with her once the 1st or 2nd insult came out.

Should have cut your losses then and looked up the next in line - try an African or Caribbean chick next, as they probably don't cart their race, slavery, white oppression, etc. around on their verbal shoulders.

However, the storm of comments--often cringe-worthy--on this thread DID make interesting reading.

Geekette221B
Geekette221B

@KalEl72 I think her suspicions had more to do with the fact that you are a man, than that you are white. Personally, I've had BM approach me with the sleaziest comments imaginable. I'm not talking about strangers on the street, I'm talking about guys that were formally introduced to me by other women. Guys will say hello then jump to all of the sexual stuff he wants to do to me. When the guy realizes that no booty is instantly forthcoming, he'll get pissy and disappear. This is typical behavior. Why? The guy felt entitled to nookie because he spoke to me.

Your joke about CPT and brief comment about only dating black at this early stage of the game set off alarms of male entitlement and questionable intentions. I will admit though, she did overreact to you. As you know, everything went downhill quickly after that. And I still don't understand that mother comment. Was she trying to say that you have mommy issues?

Anyway, as I said before, slow down. Remember the rules of polite conversation when you're just getting to know each other. Avoid racial, political, sexual and religious topics. Period. Also avoid anything generally unpleasant or frightening. Avoid talking about your ex or your latest diet or your bodily functions. You get the point.

Dating is supposed to be FUN! You both overdid things a bit. Talk about hobbies or film or your children or pets. Get to know each other's moods, personality and sense of humor. You know, enjoy each other's company. Then see what develops from there.

KalEl72
KalEl72

@zipporah That is my youngest daughter when she was younger. Her eyes have changed to more of my color now. Kal El, Superman, is my favorite superhero.

KalEl72
KalEl72

From what I understand OK Cupid asks questions to find compatibility. It doesn't take into account preferences, only the answers you give to the questions they ask. For instance this lady in question and I were supposed to be a 95% match. WHAAAAT?!?! As you can tell they were way wrong. It's a free site though so you can't expect a lot.

ElLagoJeff
ElLagoJeff

@Geekette221B That's a great response, and I couldn't agree more.  I'm a WM and I NEVER bring up anything regarding race when I'm getting to know a BW.  EVER.  That discussion is for later, much, much later on in the relationship.


My only point of disagreement is, whoever said dating was supposed to be fun?  Feels more like work to me, but then, nothing worthwhile ever came without struggle.

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 


If the BM who respond can’t figure out that I only want non-blacks, it makes me wonder if the WM they send me probably don’t even know I’m black. How awkward that could be.

Have you had WW respond to you, and how did you respond back, if so?

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 

Lol!!! And not an IR site.  Oh, well... there's plenty of fish out there...just don't go to POF's site.

Maxine
Maxine

@KalEl72 Does OK Cupid have an email for customer service?  Because I think it'd be helpful to send them a message that you specified a preference for black women but are getting 95% white profiles.  You never know...it may be happening to others and until they hear enough about  it, they won't think it  matters.

BreannaNouveaux
BreannaNouveaux

I think its supposed to be fun. I just stop when it feels like a lot of work. :)

KalEl72
KalEl72

@Justme65 Yes I have, but that lets me know they didn't read my profile. When they send me messages I just ignore them.

KalEl72
KalEl72

@Maxine I looked and they do have a couple of email addresses, but noe that i see for customer service. They do offer a feed back section. I am sending them feed back now.

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 @Justme65 

I feel soooo tempted to ask one of the WM if he knows that I'm black.  I'm gonna do it, lol.  That will also help me get to the root of this problem.  If he/they respond, I'll let y'all know what he/they said.

Maxine
Maxine

@KalEl72 I remember an episode of Millionaire Matchmaker where there was a twentysomething Southern white guy who said his preference was dark-skinned women and named a couple of black celebrities as his dream woman.  Well the host stacked his mixer with white women with brown hair!

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 @Maxine 

What did you say in your response?  Can you give me the website address to do this?

Justme65
Justme65

@KalEl72 


Okay, well I have to pay $17.99 to see his response to if he realizes I only date IR.  Not happening!


KalEl72
KalEl72

That is what I hate about those shows.

KalEl72
KalEl72

@Justme65 @Maxine On the OK Cupid site at the bottom it has a link for Contact. I clicked on it and then clicked on feed back.